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Thread: Time to next level calculator

  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sixpence View Post
    calling 'ninja' on the word 'dude'!
    I'm pretty sure that's racist.
    ~VoV~

  2. #12
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    Of course this is only meant to give you a rough idea of how much longer you'd need for the next level . Everyone knows xp can be random.

    You did give me an idea with Monkey King though. Would you say that, on the very long run, a +10% Monkey King gives you an extra 10% energy and stam. Is that how he works ? (I don't own any copies... )

    I am thinking of including him in the spreadsheet, along with a warning that actual mk returns may be ... erratic
    Last edited by zserg; 09-21-2019 at 05:08 AM.

  3. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by zserg View Post
    Of course this is only meant to give you a rough idea of how much longer you'd need for the next level . Everyone knows xp can be random.

    You did give me an idea with Monkey King though. Would you say that, on the very long run, a +10% Monkey King gives you an extra 10% energy and stam. Is that how he works ? (I don't own any copies... )

    I am thinking of including him in the spreadsheet, along with a warning that actual mk returns may be ... erratic
    1. zserg: I had no comments about your calculator. My comments were directed toward sixpence and only in a narrow scope. Recall sixpence advised us s/he routinely wastes 6,000 to 8,000 energy at a time (clearly not the paragon of someone who levels up efficiently).

    2. Here’s the reason that bothered me so much by sixpence’s comment.

    Every 2.5 minutes we get 1 energy & 1 stamina from regeneration. So at 1.3 XP per energy & 2.2 XP per stamina, you get 3.5 XP per 2.5 minutes on average (we have to add the words on average because XP from stamina on mobs has variance). Again XP from quests has NO VARIANCE (no need to use on average disclaimer) and why I tend to use energy refills than stamina refills: if the specific quest gives 1.3 XP per energy, it gives 1.3 XP per energy EVERY TIME.

    This 3.5 XP per 2.5 minutes on average is no different 84 XP per hour (on average) that sixpence advanced.

    My problem was 2.2/3.5 (or 52.8/84 in sixpence notation) was 62.86% of the XP had variance. The majority of sixpence’s 84 factor has variance.

    Suppose we looked at a power level that spammed Cefka’s quest and gets 1.75 XP per 1 energy. So every 2.5 minutes, he gets 1.75 + 2.2 for a combined 3.95 XP per 2.5 minutes *on average*. Notice that 2.2 / 3.95 is only 55.70%. There is less variance in this calculation.

    In summary:
    1. the order of using energy or stamina first when leveling up is important: Do the stamina side first so if it falls short, you have flexibility to change quests from 1.3 to a higher XP to energy quests and still level up. The player that uses energy first AND THEN use stamina and faces a XP shortfall now has to wait for regen to level up.

    2. The more XP that comes from stamina out of total XP to level, the more you need to pay attention for XP shortfall because XP from quests can only make up so much of the shortfall: cefka’s duel is capped at 1.75 XP per energy.

    sixpence’s advice uses 62.86% XP that has variance and thus any XP shortfall may not be made up by higher XP to energy quests.

    My comment is not about the calculator but rather sixpence gave out bad advice without the necessary caveats.

    You should add these TWO POINTS to your calculator:
    - order is important (Stamina activities first!)
    - % of XP from variance is important ... this is where the XP shortfall comes (and not the quest-energy side)

  4. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by zserg View Post
    Of course this is only meant to give you a rough idea of how much longer you'd need for the next level . Everyone knows xp can be random.

    You did give me an idea with Monkey King though. Would you say that, on the very long run, a +10% Monkey King gives you an extra 10% energy and stam. Is that how he works ? (I don't own any copies... )

    I am thinking of including him in the spreadsheet, along with a warning that actual mk returns may be ... erratic
    1. The other thing to keep in mind is Sigma Energy vs Sigma Stamina or the amount of SP’s allocated to energy & stamina, respectively. This is different than sixpence’s natural regen comment.

    Players with more Sigma Energy than Sigma Stamina are going to level up more predictably (other things being equal) than Sigma Stamina > Sigma Energy.

    You look at Overlord and ask yourself how is he able to level up so fast — he has a huge amount of energy that lets him get (1) high XP to energy via quests and (2) in a predictable way (or at least more predictable than XP from stamina by hitting mobs).

    However, the Dev made Stamina more valuable than energy due to Events like Meteorite, TI, etc where rewards are more efficiently earned via stamina. So in Overlord’s case, his massive energy to get drops when used for healing or strengthening is so great that it offsets the stamina advantage.

    Overlord won the last Meteorite and should be the heavy favorite to win first place in the Tenth Anniversary Event.

    2. MK allows players to use less resources to level up but the trade-off is a lot more unreliability in when to level up. So now both XP from quests and XP from mobs are really hard to predict.

    In summary: the role of Sigma energy to Sigma Stamina and Sigma Energy to sum of energy from regen plays a role in helping the player to level up predictably.

  5. #15
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    This is interesting, but thinking about it, I think even if I managed to integrate some statistics in the spreadsheet it would just end up more confusing for the average user. (and I'd probably mess it up too).

    I guess people should just always remember that randomness can screw your plans up...and plan accordingly.

  6. #16
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    Xp from questing does give a variance. For people that haven't finished questing, there can be an extreme variance going from one quest to the next. Yes, it can be controlled better, but xp return still changes once a quest has been leveled.

    Plus some energy may be needed for healing monsters, or trading and mining essence.
    Last edited by VersionsOfViolence; 09-22-2019 at 04:29 PM.
    ~VoV~

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by VersionsOfViolence View Post
    Ok dude. You can either take all those words and make a spreadsheet I can put real numbers into, or you can shove em.
    Hes passionate about theory, but uninterested in practice. Perhaps hes in academia.

  8. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by zserg View Post
    This is interesting, but thinking about it, I think even if I managed to integrate some statistics in the spreadsheet it would just end up more confusing for the average user. (and I'd probably mess it up too).

    I guess people should just always remember that randomness can screw your plans up...and plan accordingly.
    I didn't have a problem with your calculator because it's a tool, no more and no less. I had a problem with sixpence's rule.

    Just keep in mind that if someone uses energy for quests and stamina to hit mobs and and does not level up, it's due to shortfall in XP from hitting mobs. And this occurs often because half the time you will get more XP from mobs than needed, and half the time less XP from stamina when needed. Not leveling up happens quite often from stamina side of the equation.

  9. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by VersionsOfViolence View Post
    Xp from questing does give a variance. For people that haven't finished questing, there can be an extreme variance going from one quest to the next. Yes, it can be controlled better, but xp return still changes once a quest has been leveled.

    Plus some energy may be needed for healing monsters, or trading and mining essence.
    Nate, we have three types of quests than gives XP's for energy: (on web3) it says Quest, Demi Quest and Atlantis. On Web3, every quests gives exact XP per energy.

    gogoo commented on how healing in Meteorite gives an average of 1.4 XP to 1.0 energy with a range of 1.0 to 1.8 XP to 1 energy. But healing is not quests.

  10. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by pull lead View Post
    He’s passionate about theory, but uninterested in practice. Perhaps he’s in academia.
    And that is your opinion. And opinions are not facts.

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