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Thread: Be a calculating monster hunter!

  1. #1

    Default Be a calculating monster hunter!

    As a high LSI monster hunter, oneís attack may be low! How could you weigh MK and Matk general in your Mhunt Alliance? Here is my two cents!

    In fighting different monsters, you need to calculate the damage per stamina. For example,

    My Barbarus-Dolomar-Sorkan Alliance deals 40756 dmg/stamina in a hit!
    My Barbarus-Dolomar-Monkey King Alliance deals 38243 dmg/stamina in a hit!

    This means the 1st alliance deals 6.5% more dmg but the MK alliance got a bonus of 7.02%.
    This means the MK alliance actually could deal more dmg with the same amount of stamina !

    As different monsters have different break points, the use of a less damaging alliance with MK must be checked from time to time!
    Last edited by mayi; 03-30-2019 at 10:13 AM.
    Do I need to have a signature here? Sorry, but I honestly donít know how to do it!

  2. #2

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    Since MK also make you level up fast, you get more than just 7.02%...

  3. #3

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    You don't have to worry about Matk. It's outdated imo. You can get chaos gems with aggressive stats % and critical strike % forge in hunter gears. Also, you can enhance hunter gears up to +50. Those will make up the loss of Matk general.
    Last edited by biscuit; 03-30-2019 at 09:18 PM.

  4. #4

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    Quote Originally Posted by mayi View Post
    As a high LSI monster hunter, one’s attack may be low! How could you weigh MK and Matk general in your Mhunt Alliance? Here is my two cents!

    In fighting different monsters, you need to calculate the damage per stamina. For example,

    My Barbarus-Dolomar-Sorkan Alliance deals 40756 dmg/stamina in a hit!
    My Barbarus-Dolomar-Monkey King Alliance deals 38243 dmg/stamina in a hit!

    This means the 1st alliance deals 6.5% more dmg but the MK alliance got a bonus of 7.02%.
    This means the MK alliance actually could deal more dmg with the same amount of stamina !

    As different monsters have different break points, the use of a less damaging alliance with MK must be checked from time to time!
    Your math is flawed:
    - You don’t compare actual vs actual
    - You compare expected value vs expected value and take the alliance gives you the highest expected value of damage per stamina. In plain English, you want the highest and best use, which is its expected value. That is good enough for most players.

    Cheers

    PS I am risk adverse, so I use EV/Var vs EV as my metric.

  5. #5

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eric Suen View Post
    Since MK also make you level up fast, you get more than just 7.02%...
    My raw ark is low! BSI at 0.89 only. Fast levelling is good but Very ill performance makes no sense!
    Do I need to have a signature here? Sorry, but I honestly donít know how to do it!

  6. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by biscuit View Post
    You don't have to worry about Matk. It's outdated imo. You can get chaos gems with aggressive stats % and critical strike % forge in hunter gears. Also, you can enhance hunter gears up to +50. Those will make up the loss of Matk general.
    There is always a damage gap between your Best Mhunt alliance and your MK Mhunt alliance. AGG general bonus enhances the damage but does not work for MK! Sorkan and Sahar (with equipment) enjoys one or two more % of crit if they are the master generals. When you have a low bonus from MK, you really need to think about the pros and cons especially you have low raw ark, low IA and low attack rune! Remember general stats bonus could only compensate the damage, not the gap between your attack and the monster armour!

    Also, Sorkan is outdated to BSI built players but not to LSI-built In addition, it is not unlikely that some new monsters may require 6000 - 7000 attack to deal decent damage!
    Last edited by mayi; 03-30-2019 at 10:33 PM.
    Do I need to have a signature here? Sorry, but I honestly donít know how to do it!

  7. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by Batw View Post
    Your math is flawed:
    - You don’t compare actual vs actual
    - You compare expected value vs expected value and take the alliance gives you the highest expected value of damage per stamina. In plain English, you want the highest and best use, which is its expected value. That is good enough for most players.

    Cheers

    PS I am risk adverse, so I use EV/Var vs EV as my metric.
    When you can keep other factor being unchanged such as equipment and crit %, a comparison of actual damage is methodologically workable and simple. I don’t need to know the monster armour or the effect of physical and elemental pierce bonus or penalty! Or What would you do if you don’t know the monster armour of shadow of phantom or Ouroboro? It is simple mathematics, but it works in all cases!
    Last edited by mayi; 03-30-2019 at 10:35 PM.
    Do I need to have a signature here? Sorry, but I honestly donít know how to do it!

  8. #8

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    The only thing that I want to know is how to objectively compare the two alliances: higher damage but no MK and lower damage with MK in different situation such as damage achievement, stamina event and with different builds such as BSI and LSI!

    Please comment!
    Do I need to have a signature here? Sorry, but I honestly donít know how to do it!

  9. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by mayi View Post
    When you can keep other factor being unchanged such as equipment and crit %, a comparison of actual damage is methodologically workable and simple. I donít need to know the monster armour or the effect of physical and elemental pierce bonus or penalty! Or What would you do if you donít know the monster armour of shadow of phantom or Ouroboro? It is simple mathematics, but it works in all cases!
    You are confused.

    Your expected damage per stamina is the weight average of critical and non-critical hits:
    - If you had a critical hit, your actual damage > expected damage.
    - If you DID NOT have a critical hit then your actual damage < expected damage.

    In both cases, the actual damage is NOT the expected damages. The standard to choose who to put into your alliance has to do with that generalís impact on your expected damage: the impact Sorkin brings to the expected damage equation vs the impact that MK brings to the same equation. This approach is very simple, easy to implement, and gives the correct answer. Using your approach in your first post will not give the correct answer since you did not look at expected damage.

    As an alternative to solving for the expected value, then do the following; heal the party health meter and then hit a non-stance mob 30 times with 1 stamina with one alliance;,heal the party health meter, and then hit mob with another alliance for another 30 times with 1 stamina ó after 30 hits, the law large should be in effect ó and choose the alliance that does the most damage. Those 30 hits is a good proxy at arriving at your expected damage per 1 stamina.

  10. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by Batw View Post
    As an alternative to solving for the expected value, then do the following; heal the party health meter and then hit a non-stance mob 30 times with 1 stamina with one alliance;,heal the party health meter, and then hit mob with another alliance for another 30 times with 1 stamina — after 30 hits, the law large should be in effect — and choose the alliance that does the most damage. Those 30 hits is a good proxy at arriving at your expected damage per 1 stamina.
    Be careful though with Barbarus if you haven't already used about 500 stamina on the monster, your damage will go up because of its ability and that will skew the results.


    Alternatively, you can also use this nice spreadsheet to calculate your damage:
    https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...uWs/edit#gid=7

    And you can play with numbers, including changing the monster breakpoint.

    However I'm not sure how you can add Barbarus % damage to this (there's no cell for it on the spreadsheet and I'm not sure whether it's additive or multiplicative with the Arena dmg bonus - probably multiplicative?).

    Also no specific cell for MK so you'll have to calculate what you get from him manually.

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