View Poll Results: What's your BSI? (extended)

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  • Chain Zserg

    30 25.86%
  • <10

    45 38.79%
  • 10-15

    36 31.03%
  • 15-20

    14 12.07%
  • 20-25

    5 4.31%
  • 25-30

    4 3.45%
  • 30+

    8 6.90%
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Thread: What's your BSI?

  1. Default

    Quote Originally Posted by retribution@gmail View Post
    yea, that worked 10 years ago.... BSI is a measure of how able you are to beat other toons at a similar level, which no longer is based on A+D... For those of you living in the past perhaps but you gonna lose... BSI is a measure of strength more than anything else, not a meaningless measure that was good when generals were crap, runes didnt exist, and there was no real pierce or resistance available..

    if your a purist that wants to stay to a definition that was easy to do please do but its got no meaning any more...
    BSI, or Battle Strength Index, did indeed -used- to be a measure of one's abilities to do battle against other. However, as the game evolved so did the meaning of BSI evolve. BSI now represents your investment in attack and defense over other skills. It does -not- represent your full strength any longer (actually never did). For the most obvious of reasons.

    However... have no fear! Because since the days of BSI there have been two others indexes that are -very- effective and are in fact used by the game to determine the outcome of battles.

    Effective Attack (eAttack) and Effective Defense (eDefense).

    Those purists that you bring up would tell you that -those two- have -always- been the way to determine battle strength and that BSI was just a silly unimportant number.

    Of course you are familiar with the formulas?


    eAttack = attack + attack rune + attack IA + gear attack + general attack + 0.7 * (defense + defense rune + defense IA + gear defense + general defense)

    eDefense = defense + defense rune + defense IA + gear defense + general defense + 0.7 * (attack + attack rune + attack IA + gear attack + general attack )


    Those numbers are then multiplied by any piercing and resistance stack totals to determine the the bonuses for each of those stacks which are then added to the eAttack and eDefense to create Total eAttack and Total eDefense.

    However...

    You can't just determine the bonus for each stack in your keep and then say that your Total eAttack/eDefense is X.

    Since the number of opposing Resistance/Piercing influences the your final stack numbers you would be talking about Total Potential eAttack and Total Potential eDefense when you add your total stacks to your eAttack/eDefense. Of course all said and done your eAttack and eDefense totals are actually ranges that range from eAttack/eDefense to Total Potential eAttack/eDefense.

    Finally, I have seen some do eAttack/eDefense calculations and then divide by 100 to get what they called a "beast rating". Such ratings, while diluted from the actual eAttack/eDefense stats, are still a -lot- more accurate than BSI calculations could be since they are (obviously) all inclusive.

    Bottom line is that you didn't -need- to try and mutilate the BSI calculation into something it was never intended for. You could have simply used the formulas that existed next to it to get the number you were -actually- after.
    Last edited by Lord Reaper; 02-15-2017 at 05:44 PM.
    "Build a man a fire, keep him warm for a night. Set a man on fire, keep him warm for the rest of his life!" - Rev Sim

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  2. #212
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Reaper View Post
    BSI, or Battle Strength Index, did indeed -used- to be a measure of one's abilities to do battle against other. However, as the game evolved so did the meaning of BSI evolve. BSI now represents your investment in attack and defense over other skills. It does -not- represent your full strength any longer (actually never did). For the most obvious of reasons.

    However... have no fear! Because since the days of BSI there have been two others indexes that are -very- effective and are in fact used by the game to determine the outcome of battles.

    Effective Attack (eAttack) and Effective Defense (eDefense).

    Those purists that you bring up would tell you that -those two- have -always- been the way to determine battle strength and that BSI was just a silly unimportant number.

    Of course you are familiar with the formulas?


    eAttack = attack + attack rune + attack IA + gear attack + general attack + 0.7 * (defense + defense rune + defense IA + gear defense + general defense)

    eDefense = defense + defense rune + defense IA + gear defense + general defense + 0.7 * (attack + attack rune + attack IA + gear attack + general attack )


    Those numbers are then multiplied by any piercing and resistance stack totals to determine the the bonuses for each of those stacks which are then added to the eAttack and eDefense to create Total eAttack and Total eDefense.

    However...

    You can't just determine the bonus for each stack in your keep and then say that your Total eAttack/eDefense is X.

    Since the number of opposing Resistance/Piercing influences the your final stack numbers you would be talking about Total Potential eAttack and Total Potential eDefense when you add your total stacks to your eAttack/eDefense. Of course all said and done your eAttack and eDefense totals are actually ranges that range from eAttack/eDefense to Total Potential eAttack/eDefense.

    Finally, I have seen some do eAttack/eDefense calculations and then divide by 100 to get what they called a "beast rating". Such ratings, while diluted from the actual eAttack/eDefense stats, are still a -lot- more accurate than BSI calculations could be since they are (obviously) all inclusive.

    Bottom line is that you didn't -need- to try and mutilate the BSI calculation into something it was never intended for. You could have simply used the formulas that existed next to it to get the number you were -actually- after.
    That formula is irrelevant now as well... and rather than changing the definition of bsi should just keep the definition and update the formula... stupid to say that it's no longer battle strength indicator but we gonna keep the formula because we are too stupid to change it....

  3. Default

    Quote Originally Posted by retribution@gmail View Post
    That formula is irrelevant now as well... and rather than changing the definition of bsi should just keep the definition and update the formula... stupid to say that it's no longer battle strength indicator but we gonna keep the formula because we are too stupid to change it....
    How pray tell is it no longer relevant?

    It is -literally- the formula that the game has been using since pretty much the beginning to determine win or lose. >_> (adjusted to add new relative items such as IA and runes over time of course)

    Also... not changing the BSI formula has nothing to do with being stupid or not. It has to do with it not being necessary. There are already more accurate formulas out there such as eAttack and eDefense if you want actual attack strength.
    Last edited by Lord Reaper; 02-15-2017 at 06:14 PM.
    "Build a man a fire, keep him warm for a night. Set a man on fire, keep him warm for the rest of his life!" - Rev Sim

    "Gratuitous acts of senseless violence are -my- forte!" - Max

  4. #214

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    Is there a excel spreadsheet where we can calculate? Couldn't find it in forum

  5. #215
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ragesath View Post
    Is there a excel spreadsheet where we can calculate? Couldn't find it in forum
    http://teknosounds.com/castleage/cacalculator.php
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  6. #216
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    Default

    That's old the formulas no longer relevant to what it's for...

  7. #217
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    Quote Originally Posted by retribution@gmail View Post
    That's old the formulas no longer relevant to what it's for...
    If you ignore the pierce and resistance part (which by the way is not included in you Bsi) you can still use the calculator to see eBsi and Bsi, Lsi
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  8. #218
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    Feel free to create new formulae and indices that are relevant today. Please do give them distinctive names so they'll stand out instead of being yet another indices.
    WARNING: THE POST ABOVE MAY OR MAY NOT CONTAIN SARCASM AND/OR IRONY!

    Elandal [FIN] ΛĢ 8218DD

  9. #219
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    Quote Originally Posted by zserg View Post
    And seriously, less than 10 is where I expect most people to be, and you just lumped them all in one category?

    Edit: 9,76 bsi with stuff. 7,50 BSI without stuff.

    Edit: Level 930

    Level 1023

    BSI without stuffs 8.022
    BSI with stuffs 10.487
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  10. #220
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    @level 1235, I am 5.85 raw 9.5 effective. I am pretty happy with my build. I have high energy,stamina, and health and with heroes and pierce I can beat most up to 1500.
    Of course the downside is I lose on the confuse resistance trait.
    Last edited by ₳ӿŀ; 02-17-2017 at 05:02 PM.
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