Castle Age MythBusters

[xienwolf]

Current Investigation: Rewards from a battle are based on the numerical damage dealt
Data Contributions Requested: Please post what monster you killed, your position in the damage list, and cut/paste the rewards you gained. It is helpful if you can state what category each item was from, but is not required as that information is available elsewhere in the forums.





Better Loot when the Summoner gets the last blow
Status: Confirmed FALSE
Denied in an email from the Developers themselves


Better Loot when the kill is completely faster
Status: Confirmed FALSE
Community testing has determined this myth to be inaccurate


Rewards from a battle are based on the numerical damage dealt
Status: Testing in progress, information required
No patterns seem to emerge so far. It seems that the most likely explanation is that you gain a random number of total drops, and the maximum possible is based on how much damage you deal. From there, each slot is picked much like a Treasure Chest from all possible drops, with the results being sorted after the fact. Thus you could be the highest damage dealer, but get the least amount of loot (random assignment of total loot slots not going your way), or you could hit for a single stamina and get an Epic drop (random pick of your single loot item happening to come out VERY favorable)
Basically, the only clear trend right now is that more damage = better chance of getting whatever you want from the beast. But there is quite certainly a point at which further damage has diminishing returns due to the probability involved in having things turn out any better for you.


Defense Stat does not affect damage against Monsters
Status: Testing pending, information appreciated
Each Monster seems to have a different manner of calculating the damage you deal to them, placing the largest weight on a different aspect of your character. Thus far it appears that Sylvana and Lotus (possibly all bosses?) have fairly high weight on Defense for how much damage you deal to them, while for Dragons defense has no bearing on damage dealt at all.


Quality of Loot is linked to how full the "defense" bar is at the time of kill
Status: Testing pending, information appreciated
Placed on here by request and semi-frequent surfacing. Personally, I have VERY little belief that this is true in any way shape or form. But no testing has been done to directly confirm/deny, so it will sit on the list as untested until that time.




--------------------------------

Primarily posting this to try and clear up some of the far too frequent questions on the forums. Finally decided it was time to get the data to back up my suspicion on number 3.

Please inform me of any other common "myths" (or any misconceptions really) which have already been tested one way or another. The first 2 were all I could think of at the moment. If there is something else which requires testing, feel free to post that as well, it'll get added to the list for checking out next.

[Xsavior]

Hi, Not sure if this is a myth or not. But there is a few theories saying tat defense in included in monster damage calculation while some says defense is not included in e damage calculation. I will like to know if which is actually true or false.. Thanks..:)
With regards,
Peter

[Shadron]

Hi, Not sure if this is a myth or not. But there is a few theories saying tat defense in included in monster damage calculation while some says defense is not included in e damage calculation. I will like to know if which is actually true or false.. Thanks..:)
With regards,
Peter

its both. some monsters it does indeed calculate into the damage and some it doesn't. it would be a good one to clarify which is which.

[Azraelswrd]

Depends on the monster. According to my tests, Dragons and Sylvanas really take note of player defense. The other monsters not so much.

[Sophia Dragonhunter]

I haven't kept track of my position in the leaderboards, but here's some drops information from Sea Serpents:

Emerald, 400k: 2 epic, 5 rare, 2 land
Emerald, 278k: 2 epic, 5 rare, 2 land
Emerald, 200k: 2 epic, 5 rare, 2 land
Emerald, 150k: 2 epic, 5 rare, 2 land
Emerald, 150k: 2 epic, 4 rare, 2 land
Emerald, 150k: 2 epic, 4 rare, 1 land
Emerald, 122k: 1 epic, 4 rare, 2 land
Emerald, 100k: 1 epic, 4 rare, 1 land
Emerald, 67k: 1 epic, 4 rare, 3 land
Emerald, 53k: 1 epic, 3 rare, 2 land
Emerald, 34k: 1 epic, 1 rare, 2 land
Emerald, 33k: 1 epic, 1 rare, 2 land
Emerald, 19k: 2 rare, 1 land
Emerald, 11k: 1 rare

Sapphire, 450k: 2 epic, 5 rare, 1 land
Sapphire, 350k: 2 epic, 5 rare, 1 land
Sapphire, 150k: 1 epic, 3 rare, 2 land
Sapphire, 72k: 1 epic, 1 rare, 2 land
Sapphire, 55k: 2 rare, 1 land
Sapphire, 50k: 1 rare, 3 land
Sapphire, 45k: 1 epic, 1 rare, 2 land

Amethyst, 1600k: 2 epic, 5 rare, 2 land
Amethyst, 350k: 1 epic, 4 rare, 2 land
Amethyst, 55k: 1 rare

Ancient Red, 100k: 1 epic, 1 rare, 2 land
Ancient Red, 100k: 1 rare, 1 land
Ancient Red, 200k: 1 epic, 1 rare, 3 land

There's an obvious pattern based on the damage dealt, but it's not always the same due to a probable luck factor. Nowhere is it stated that rank in the leaderboard gives better rewards. On the other hand, I wouldn't dim myth #2 as false, because it is stated in the game FAQs that the speed at which the monster is killed increases the odds of better loot.

[ZeroWinZ]

Depends on the monster. According to my tests, Dragons and Sylvanas really take note of player defense. The other monsters not so much.

hmm, I never thought they would put that into consideration.

[sarie]

I joined this battle pretty late, but it JUST died and here are the stats :]

Stats: Level 76, defence 110, attack 166
Monster: Sapphire Serpent
Time: (didn't track, sorry, but died about 2:15 AM Dec 18th if that helps for data)
General: Celesta

Loot:
You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Corvintheus!
You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Ambrosia!
You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Malekus!
You have been awarded with: Spartan Warrior! [attack: 2 defense: 1]
You have been awarded with: Spartan Shield! [attack: 0 defense: 2]
You have been awarded with: Spartan Shield! [attack: 0 defense: 2]
You have been awarded with: Griffin! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Energy Bolt! [attack: 1 defense: 1]
You have been awarded with: Moonfall Crown! [attack: 6 defense: 3]
You have been awarded with: Gift Dragon! [attack: 16 defense: 14]
You have been awarded with: Faerie Wings! [attack: 6 defense: 2]
You have been awarded with: Faerie Wings! [attack: 6 defense: 2]
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Mountain Keep!
You have been awarded with: Atlantean Helm! [attack: 4 defense: 5]

Leaderboard:
Cesar 1,048,564 dmg / 305,620 def
Ernesto 966,556 dmg / 256,910 def
Xibalta 415,305 dmg / 566,530 def
Gian Carlo 220,973 dmg / 269,790 def
Oscar 161,063 dmg / 125,710 def
Sarah 108,194 dmg / 117,090 def <-- Me
Paul 67,428 dmg / 0 def
German 18,992 dmg / 0 def
David 7,743 dmg / 0 def

[CrazyandLazy]

Rewards from a battle are based on the numerical damage dealt

I think this is FALSE because I got the Dragon Crest from my first ever Dragon fight with only around 50,000. I think there is only a base damage[really low] to get a chance to play the slot or possibility of getting an epic loot.

[xienwolf]

Ok, so our single datapoint thus far is 6th place on a Sapphire Serpent garnered:

1 Epic
3 Lands
4 Rare
5 Common
3 Points


Now we just wait on confirmation and more reports from other folks. Thanks for the VERY nice formatting by the way :)

I'll have some data of my own by the morning when the monsters I am working on drop. Hopefully I can convince my friends to do a Sapphire next and aim for 6th place myself :)

[Shadron]

Rewards from a battle are based on the numerical damage dealt

I think this is FALSE because I got the Dragon Crest from my first ever Dragon fight with only around 50,000. I think there is only a base damage[really low] to get a chance to play the slot or possibility of getting an epic loot.

this contradicts yourself. you say its false yet then you say there is a base damage.

[sarie]

Downed another one, this time, I was the summoner though :)

Stats: Level 77, defence 110, attack 166
Monster: Emerald Serpent
Time: 1 hour
General: Celesta

Loot:
2 Epic
1 Lands
6 Rare
6 Common
4 Points


You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Corvintheus!
You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Aurora!
You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Corvintheus!
You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Ambrosia!
You have been awarded with: Water Sprite! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Fire Elemental! [attack: 8 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Fire Elemental! [attack: 8 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Griffin! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Atlantean Archer! [attack: 12 defense: 10]
You have been awarded with: Willow Wisp! [attack: 4 defense: 4]
You have been awarded with: Moonfall Crown! [attack: 6 defense: 3]
You have been awarded with: Moonfall Crown! [attack: 6 defense: 3]
You have been awarded with: Sword of the Sea! [attack: 5 defense: 4]
You have been awarded with: Colossal Armor! [attack: 2 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Gift Phoenix! [attack: 20 defense: 16]
You have been awarded with: Gift Dragon! [attack: 16 defense: 14]
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Tempest Shield! [attack: 4 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Atlantean Map Piece! [attack: defense: ]
Leaderboard:
[DSC] Ron Hughes 827,567 dmg / 182,340 def
Sarah 232,638 dmg / 123,197 def <--me
Julia 127,430 dmg / 39,920 def
Mivenya 100,165 dmg / 54,140 def
Chris 116,752 dmg / 0 def
Danh 98,338 dmg / 0 def
Sang Hann 54,873 dmg / 0 def


I am also in a friends Sylvanas fight, although I don't plan to do a lot a lot of damage, it's more of a let people in to get their achievement sort of fight. Will let you know when that is done tomorrow probably :] ANd for the formatting, no problem, it's keeping me amused for now.

ETA Oh, and, I don't have thge full data for the one lotus fight I have been in, but I did something like 823K damage (it's in a screenshot somewhere) placed like... fourth or fifth? and I did get the gauntlet off that fight. Although, not sure that data matters since I didn't save the rest of it.

[Shadron]

i will start saving my data from serpents since i have a considerable amount of defense.

[strife97]

Since I FINALLY got my Dragon Scale and made my Helm, I got my friends who helped kill our friend's Frost Dragon to give me a list of what they got, so I compiled it all nice for you cuz I'm in a good mood :D (Was gonna do it even if I didn't get it, had already made my friends try and have their final damage near each other, that turned out rather well too). And this should really help your date since Frost Dragons have recently been within 800K-1.2 M HP rather than the pre-stated 700K-850K (I personally like the increase of HP)

Here are the Rare and Epic Loot Drops available (so you don't have to look it up)

Rare Chance Drops
[Dragonbane]
[Greater Fireball]
[Moonfall Crown]
[Avenger Amulet]
[Gift Dragon]
[Gift Phoenix]

Epic Chance Drops:
[Lightbringer]
[Dragon Scale]
[Sun Blade]
[Wolf Spirit]
[Berserker Amulet]

178,642 dmg (Me, 1st)
1 FP
5 Demi
5 Common
3 Rare
2 Land
1 Epic

You have been awarded 1 Favor Points!
You have been rewarded 2 demi points of Aurora!
You have been rewarded 3 demi points of Ambrosia!
You have been awarded with: War Bear! [attack: 5 defense: 4]
You have been awarded with: Griffin! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Magic Missile! [attack: 1 defense: 0]
You have been awarded with: Willow Wisp! [attack: 4 defense: 4]
You have been awarded with: War Bear! [attack: 5 defense: 4]
You have been awarded with: Dragonbane! [attack: 5 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Greater Fireball! [attack: 6 defense: 1]
You have been awarded with: Gift Dragon! [attack: 16 defense: 14]
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Dragon Scale! [attack: 4 defense: 9]


177,079 dmg (2nd)
9 Demi
3 Common
3 Rare
2 Land
1 Epic

You have been rewarded 2 demi points of Corvintheus!
You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Corvintheus!
You have been rewarded 3 demi points of Ambrosia!
You have been rewarded 2 demi points of Aurora!
You have been awarded with: Energy Bolt! [attack: 1 defense: 1]
You have been awarded with: Fire Elemental! [attack: 8 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Griffin! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Gift Dragon! [attack: 16 defense: 14]
You have been awarded with: Dragonbane! [attack: 5 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Greater Fireball! [attack: 6 defense: 1]
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Sky Sanctuary!
You have been awarded with: Dragon Scale! [attack: 4 defense: 9]

140,549 dmg (3rd)
2 FP
3 Demi
4 Common
2 Rare
3 Land

You have been awarded 1 Favor Points!
You have been rewarded 3 demi points of Aurora!
You have been awarded 1 Favor Points!
You have been awarded with: War Lion! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Sun Eagle! [attack: 15 defense: 12]
You have been awarded with: Energy Bolt! [attack: 1 defense: 1]
You have been awarded with: Fire Elemental! [attack: 8 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Greater Fireball! [attack: 6 defense: 1]
You have been awarded with: Gift Phoenix! [attack: 20 defense: 16]
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!

140,432 dmg (4th)
1 FP
5 Demi
3 Common
1 Rare
3 Land
1 Epic

You have been awarded 1 Favor Points!
You have been rewarded 2 demi points of Malekus!
You have been rewarded 3 demi points of Malekus!
You have been awarded with: War Lion! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: War Lion! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: War Bear! [attack: 5 defense: 4]
You have been awarded with: Moonfall Crown! [attack: 6 defense: 3]
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Berserker Amulet! [attack: 5 defense: 4]

112,075 dmg (5th)
2 FP
3 Demi
5 Common
1 Rare
1 Land
1 Epic

You have been awarded 1 Favor Points!
You have been rewarded 3 demi points of Corvintheus!
You have been awarded 1 Favor Points!
You have been awarded with: Energy Bolt! [attack: 1 defense: 1]
You have been awarded with: War Bear! [attack: 5 defense: 4]
You have been awarded with: Magic Missile! [attack: 1 defense: 0]
You have been awarded with: Magic Missile! [attack: 1 defense: 0]
You have been awarded with: War Lion! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Gift Dragon! [attack: 16 defense: 14]
You have been awarded with: Castle!
You have been awarded with: Dragon Scale! [attack: 4 defense: 9]

112,055 smg (6th)
1 FP
3 Demi
3 Common
1 Rare
3 Land
1 Epic

You have been rewarded 3 demi points of Malekus!
You have been awarded 1 Favor Points!
You have been awarded with: Water Sprite! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Water Sprite! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Water Sprite! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Gift Dragon! [attack: 16 defense: 14]
You have been awarded with: Mountain Keep!
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Dragon Scale! [attack: 4 defense: 9]

111,833 dmg (7th)
2 Demi
4 Common
2 Rare
3 Land
1 Epic

You have been rewarded 2 demi points of Azeron!
You have been awarded with: Griffin! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Water Elemental! [attack: 14 defense: 15]
You have been awarded with: War Bear! [attack: 5 defense: 4]
You have been awarded with: Fire Elemental! [attack: 8 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Avenger Amulet! [attack: 5 defense: 2]
You have been awarded with: Greater Fireball! [attack: 6 defense: 1]
You have been awarded with: Castle!
You have been awarded with: Mountain Keep!
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Dragon Scale! [attack: 4 defense: 9]

74,760 dmg (8th)

3 Demi
4 Common
2 Rare
2 Land
1 Epic

You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Ambrosia!
You have been rewarded 2 demi points of Aurora!
You have been awarded with: War Bear! [attack: 5 defense: 4]
You have been awarded with: Griffin! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Water Sprite! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Water Sprite! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Moonfall Crown! [attack: 6 defense: 3]
You have been awarded with: Dragonbane! [attack: 5 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Castle!
You have been awarded with: Castle!
You have been awarded with: Berserker Amulet! [attack: 5 defense: 4]

Hope that's of much use =] And also for those who are interested, here's the HP of the last few Frost Dragon's I've fought

Recent Frost Dragon HP
931,844
1,092,692
940,791
843,473
1,084,935
975,409
916,642
1,018,175
1,110,957
1,120,763
1,047,425

[Psyanne]

Minimal Damage Epic Loots

Look for a dying monster 10 to 15 or 20% health left (depends on your stamina I have 500) You should kill the monster fast (Fast before someone broke your chain attack) using your power attacks, this will trick the system that you are soloing the monster. You don't have to be on top to get a better loot.

We are on different time zone (Asia) I'm a scavenger = I'll eat your dying monster while you sleep.

[Rufuszz]

Minimal Damage Epic Loots

Look for a dying monster 10 to 15 or 20% health left (depends on your stamina I have 500) You should kill the monster fast (Fast before someone broke your chain attack) using your power attacks, this will trick the system that you are soloing the monster. You don't have to be on top to get a better loot.

We are on different time zone (Asia) I'm a scavenger = I'll eat your dying monster while you sleep.

sure bout it?? I don't think the program system is stupid enough to be fooled by something like that ;)

[Blade58]

I have been doing tests similar to azraelswrd and i definitely can confirm that some monsters take the def stat into account.. IE dragons...

[Psyanne]

sure bout it?? I don't think the program system is stupid enough to be fooled by something like that ;)

Zyan Zangetsu's Emerald Sea Serpent

You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Azeron!
You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Aurora!
You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Aurora!
You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Corvintheus!
You have been awarded with: Fire Elemental! [attack: 8 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Spartan Spear! [attack: 2 defense: 0]
You have been awarded with: Griffin! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Fire Elemental! [attack: 8 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Spartan Spear! [attack: 2 defense: 0]
You have been awarded with: Moonfall Crown! [attack: 6 defense: 3]
You have been awarded with: Gift Dragon! [attack: 16 defense: 14]
You have been awarded with: Sword of the Sea! [attack: 5 defense: 4]
You have been awarded with: Sword of the Sea! [attack: 5 defense: 4]
You have been awarded with: Gift Phoenix! [attack: 20 defense: 16]
You have been awarded with: Mountain Keep!
You have been awarded with: Mountain Keep!
You have been awarded with: Mountain Keep!
You have been awarded with: Atlantean Shield! [attack: 7 defense: 7]
You have been awarded with: Atlantean Shield! [attack: 7 defense: 7]

Nico 994,444 dmg / 280,270 def
Sidney 365,829 dmg / 0 def
Zyan Zangetsu 137,257 dmg / 120,450 def
Amp 17,201 dmg / 19,830 def

Try it ;)

[Psyanne]

Lorna's Amethyst Sea Serpent

You have been awarded 2 Favor Points!
You have been awarded 1 Favor Points!
You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Aurora!
You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Malekus!
You have been awarded with: Spartan Shield! [attack: 0 defense: 2]
You have been awarded with: Vampire! [attack: 8 defense: 7]
You have been awarded with: Death Knight! [attack: 9 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Black Knight! [attack: 5 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Lich! [attack: 7 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Vampire! [attack: 8 defense: 7]
You have been awarded with: Elven Plate! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Holy Shield! [attack: 4 defense: 2]
You have been awarded with: Demonic Mask! [attack: 6 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Atlantean Helm! [attack: 4 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Atlantean Spear! [attack: 7 defense: 7]

Lorna 3,052,234 dmg / 1,673,240 def
LADY MARIANNE 1,582,069 dmg / 501,760 def
Giwrgos 558,914 dmg / 89,770 def
Sidney 392,127 dmg / 0 def
Cryo 246,152 dmg / 0 def
Wren 116,717 dmg / 122,470 def
Tedy 44,852 dmg / 8,140 def
Dave 214 dmg / 52,650 def
Elizabeth 4,637 dmg / 15,640 def
gutter 6,326 dmg / 0 def

[Rufuszz]

ummm.. well.. that is not 'tricking the system that u'r soloing'. that is 'making quite some dmg at the last moment'.

I ever tried something like that. Instead of dealing huge amt of dmg into a hydra at the first couple time it's summoned and then wait hours and then spend stam dealing dmg while waiting for it to be dead, I looked for hydras w/ last stand call, then pump quite some dmg.. and well.. I'm not the one doing the finishing blow. I dunno if it's the player or last stand that killed it, what matter is... I got quite some loot 'fast'. Rather than spending time on a hydra for long, I made dmg at the last moment (since it'd die by last stand anyway).

Compared to those top ranks, the loots aren't that good, but compared to the time I 'spend' w/ the hydra on my list, it's quite 'good'. . .

[solkyro]

another weird event ?!

i damaged a cronus for 100k only yet i yielded an atlas, which is an epic drop, when the cronus was defeated after nearly 120 hours or so

yet when i damaged over 1m, all i got was prometheus and rhea

[avsquare]

another weird event ?!

i damaged a cronus for 100k only yet i yielded an atlas, which is an epic drop, when the cronus was defeated after nearly 120 hours or so

yet when i damaged over 1m, all i got was prometheus and rhea

it's just that when you deal more damage, it gives you more chance for an epic, and also more no. of rewards.

My friend dealt only 50k damage to a frost dragon, it's his first ever dragon and he got the dragon scale.

[Jehann]

I have been doing tests similar to azraelswrd and i definitely can confirm that some monsters take the def stat into account.. IE dragons...

Can we put to rest the myth that defense is useless, now?? :p

[Zoltàn83]

Hmmmmm


Better Loot when the kill is completely faster
Status: Confirmed FALSE

* Community testing has determined this myth to be inaccurate


I'd just like to point you to the Help/FAQ of castle age, monster:

Attacking and Damage:
Each successful attack on the monster requires 1 Stamina. If you miss or the monster evades your attack, no stamina will be taken.

The more total damage you do to the monster, the better chance you will have to get better rewards. Keep in mind the faster you kill the monster, the better chance you will have to get better rewards. Damage done depends on your attack skill. Damage taken depends on your defense skill.



So I think you might be wrong with that part...

[Shadron]

Zyan Zangetsu's Emerald Sea Serpent

You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Azeron!
You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Aurora!
You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Aurora!
You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Corvintheus!
You have been awarded with: Fire Elemental! [attack: 8 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Spartan Spear! [attack: 2 defense: 0]
You have been awarded with: Griffin! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Fire Elemental! [attack: 8 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Spartan Spear! [attack: 2 defense: 0]
You have been awarded with: Moonfall Crown! [attack: 6 defense: 3]
You have been awarded with: Gift Dragon! [attack: 16 defense: 14]
You have been awarded with: Sword of the Sea! [attack: 5 defense: 4]
You have been awarded with: Sword of the Sea! [attack: 5 defense: 4]
You have been awarded with: Gift Phoenix! [attack: 20 defense: 16]
You have been awarded with: Mountain Keep!
You have been awarded with: Mountain Keep!
You have been awarded with: Mountain Keep!
You have been awarded with: Atlantean Shield! [attack: 7 defense: 7]
You have been awarded with: Atlantean Shield! [attack: 7 defense: 7]

Nico 994,444 dmg / 280,270 def
Sidney 365,829 dmg / 0 def
Zyan Zangetsu 137,257 dmg / 120,450 def
Amp 17,201 dmg / 19,830 def

Try it ;)

i have actually done less then this, about 150k, and got 2 shields. the damage was done at the start and i left and moved onto other serpents. again i highly doubt it matters when you attack.

[valder]

What about the idea that you get better loot on serpent battles if your ship has high health when the serpent dies? Has this been confirmed/disproved somewhere?

[xienwolf]

Since I FINALLY got my Dragon Scale and made my Helm, I got my friends who helped kill our friend's Frost Dragon to give me a list of what they got, so I compiled it all nice for you cuz I'm in a good mood :D (Was gonna do it even if I didn't get it, had already made my friends try and have their final damage near each other, that turned out rather well too). And this should really help your date since Frost Dragons have recently been within 800K-1.2 M HP rather than the pre-stated 700K-850K (I personally like the increase of HP)

Here are the Rare and Epic Loot Drops available (so you don't have to look it up)

Rare Chance Drops
[Dragonbane]
[Greater Fireball]
[Moonfall Crown]
[Avenger Amulet]
[Gift Dragon]
[Gift Phoenix]

Epic Chance Drops:
[Lightbringer]
[Dragon Scale]
[Sun Blade]
[Wolf Spirit]
[Berserker Amulet]

178,642 dmg (Me)
1 FP
5 Demi
5 Common
3 Rare
2 Land
1 Epic

You have been awarded 1 Favor Points!
You have been rewarded 2 demi points of Aurora!
You have been rewarded 3 demi points of Ambrosia!
You have been awarded with: War Bear! [attack: 5 defense: 4]
You have been awarded with: Griffin! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Magic Missile! [attack: 1 defense: 0]
You have been awarded with: Willow Wisp! [attack: 4 defense: 4]
You have been awarded with: War Bear! [attack: 5 defense: 4]
You have been awarded with: Dragonbane! [attack: 5 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Greater Fireball! [attack: 6 defense: 1]
You have been awarded with: Gift Dragon! [attack: 16 defense: 14]
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Dragon Scale! [attack: 4 defense: 9]


177,079 dmg
9 Demi
3 Common
3 Rare
2 Land
1 Epic

You have been rewarded 2 demi points of Corvintheus!
You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Corvintheus!
You have been rewarded 3 demi points of Ambrosia!
You have been rewarded 2 demi points of Aurora!
You have been awarded with: Energy Bolt! [attack: 1 defense: 1]
You have been awarded with: Fire Elemental! [attack: 8 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Griffin! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Gift Dragon! [attack: 16 defense: 14]
You have been awarded with: Dragonbane! [attack: 5 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Greater Fireball! [attack: 6 defense: 1]
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Sky Sanctuary!
You have been awarded with: Dragon Scale! [attack: 4 defense: 9]

140,549 dmg
2 FP
3 Demi
4 Common
2 Rare
3 Land

You have been awarded 1 Favor Points!
You have been rewarded 3 demi points of Aurora!
You have been awarded 1 Favor Points!
You have been awarded with: War Lion! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Sun Eagle! [attack: 15 defense: 12]
You have been awarded with: Energy Bolt! [attack: 1 defense: 1]
You have been awarded with: Fire Elemental! [attack: 8 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Greater Fireball! [attack: 6 defense: 1]
You have been awarded with: Gift Phoenix! [attack: 20 defense: 16]
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!

140,432 dmg
1 FP
5 Demi
3 Common
1 Rare
3 Land
1 Epic

You have been awarded 1 Favor Points!
You have been rewarded 2 demi points of Malekus!
You have been rewarded 3 demi points of Malekus!
You have been awarded with: War Lion! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: War Lion! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: War Bear! [attack: 5 defense: 4]
You have been awarded with: Moonfall Crown! [attack: 6 defense: 3]
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Berserker Amulet! [attack: 5 defense: 4]

112,075 dmg
2 FP
3 Demi
5 Common
1 Rare
1 Land
1 Epic

You have been awarded 1 Favor Points!
You have been rewarded 3 demi points of Corvintheus!
You have been awarded 1 Favor Points!
You have been awarded with: Energy Bolt! [attack: 1 defense: 1]
You have been awarded with: War Bear! [attack: 5 defense: 4]
You have been awarded with: Magic Missile! [attack: 1 defense: 0]
You have been awarded with: Magic Missile! [attack: 1 defense: 0]
You have been awarded with: War Lion! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Gift Dragon! [attack: 16 defense: 14]
You have been awarded with: Castle!
You have been awarded with: Dragon Scale! [attack: 4 defense: 9]

112,055 smg
1 FP
3 Demi
3 Common
1 Rare
3 Land
1 Epic

You have been rewarded 3 demi points of Malekus!
You have been awarded 1 Favor Points!
You have been awarded with: Water Sprite! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Water Sprite! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Water Sprite! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Gift Dragon! [attack: 16 defense: 14]
You have been awarded with: Mountain Keep!
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Dragon Scale! [attack: 4 defense: 9]

111,833 dmg
2 Demi
4 Common
2 Rare
3 Land
1 Epic

You have been rewarded 2 demi points of Azeron!
You have been awarded with: Griffin! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Water Elemental! [attack: 14 defense: 15]
You have been awarded with: War Bear! [attack: 5 defense: 4]
You have been awarded with: Fire Elemental! [attack: 8 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Avenger Amulet! [attack: 5 defense: 2]
You have been awarded with: Greater Fireball! [attack: 6 defense: 1]
You have been awarded with: Castle!
You have been awarded with: Mountain Keep!
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Dragon Scale! [attack: 4 defense: 9]

74,760 dmg

3 Demi
4 Common
2 Rare
2 Land
1 Epic

You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Ambrosia!
You have been rewarded 2 demi points of Aurora!
You have been awarded with: War Bear! [attack: 5 defense: 4]
You have been awarded with: Griffin! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Water Sprite! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Water Sprite! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Moonfall Crown! [attack: 6 defense: 3]
You have been awarded with: Dragonbane! [attack: 5 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Castle!
You have been awarded with: Castle!
You have been awarded with: Berserker Amulet! [attack: 5 defense: 4]

Hope that's of much use =] And also for those who are interested, here's the HP of the last few Frost Dragon's I've fought

Recent Frost Dragon HP
931,844
1,092,692
940,791
843,473
1,084,935
975,409
916,642
1,018,175
1,110,957
1,120,763
1,047,425

While this might work as counter-point to the data once compiled, if required, it isn't COMPLETELY useful as I need to know what your ranking in the damage lists was as well, not just the damage which you dealt.

[xienwolf]

Hmmmmm


Better Loot when the kill is completely faster
Status: Confirmed FALSE

* Community testing has determined this myth to be inaccurate


I'd just like to point you to the Help/FAQ of castle age, monster:

Attacking and Damage:
Each successful attack on the monster requires 1 Stamina. If you miss or the monster evades your attack, no stamina will be taken.

The more total damage you do to the monster, the better chance you will have to get better rewards. Keep in mind the faster you kill the monster, the better chance you will have to get better rewards. Damage done depends on your attack skill. Damage taken depends on your defense skill.



So I think you might be wrong with that part...


There are quiet a few instances of the Help/FAQ text being incorrect. For example, how many times have you managed to build the Orc King, Colossus, Sylvana or Lotus from the parts they drop?

[Shyft-]

This is absurd. Enough already!

Defense does affect monster damage. This is true for all monsters. This has been tested over a very large sample size. Most current example for me personally is L4 Ambrosia compared to L4 Mephistopheles vs Keira (the most commonly used example for a Monster where defense doesn't matter). In a sample size of 50 power attacks each, Ambrosia did an average of ~73 points more per attack. That's well outside the margin of error. Defense still isn't as good as attack for this purpose, but it matters.

Monster rewards are ONLY based on the damage you deal. There is a luck factor involved, but if you deal higher damage, you get better rewards. There is a significant point of diminishing returns; for instance you are barely getting anything better for doing 150k to an Emerald Serpent than 100k, generally a few more loot slots, but it's a lot less to get to the 1 epic tier than the 2 epic tier, and who really cares about the non-epics?

Killing faster = better loot has for some reason not been removed from the in-game text, but if there still is an effect from that it's been EXTREMELY trivialized in the game by the devs as a response to players many months ago. Some regular posters on these forums have even claimed to have confirmation from CA devs that faster is no longer better.

Your "rank" on the damage board does NOT IN ANY WAY affect loot; it's only there for reference purposes and as a way to sort the list on the monster battle. THE ONLY THING THAT MATTERS IS THE AMOUNT OF DAMAGE (+FORTIFICATION FOR SERPS).

The real myth to dispel is that your placement on the damage listing matters at all. It doesn't. Just the total amount of damage. In the immortal words of Bob Sagat, "F***ing stop it."

[Landong]

Myths: More people attacking, more drop lot chances for all...

[Shadron]

This is absurd. Enough already!

Defense does affect monster damage. This is true for all monsters. This has been tested over a very large sample size. Most current example for me personally is L4 Ambrosia compared to L4 Mephistopheles vs Keira (the most commonly used example for a Monster where defense doesn't matter). In a sample size of 50 power attacks each, Ambrosia did an average of ~73 points more per attack. That's well outside the margin of error. Defense still isn't as good as attack for this purpose, but it matters.

Monster rewards are ONLY based on the damage you deal. There is a luck factor involved, but if you deal higher damage, you get better rewards. There is a significant point of diminishing returns; for instance you are barely getting anything better for doing 150k to an Emerald Serpent than 100k, generally a few more loot slots, but it's a lot less to get to the 1 epic tier than the 2 epic tier, and who really cares about the non-epics?

Killing faster = better loot has for some reason not been removed from the in-game text, but if there still is an effect from that it's been EXTREMELY trivialized in the game by the devs as a response to players many months ago. Some regular posters on these forums have even claimed to have confirmation from CA devs that faster is no longer better.

Your "rank" on the damage board does NOT IN ANY WAY affect loot; it's only there for reference purposes and as a way to sort the list on the monster battle. THE ONLY THING THAT MATTERS IS THE AMOUNT OF DAMAGE (+FORTIFICATION FOR SERPS).

The real myth to dispel is that your placement on the damage listing matters at all. It doesn't. Just the total amount of damage. In the immortal words of Bob Sagat, "F***ing stop it."

step back. take a deep breath. its just a forum.

[Sir Markus]

We need Jamie here....

http://ui29.gamespot.com/156/mythwalrus_2.jpg

[JakeBones]

I can say without a shadow of a doubt that damage dealt does not affect the loot drops at all this is why:

Emerald Dragon: 2 attackers, me and a friend

Damage i dealt: 499,500 damage
Damage he dealt: 105,800 damage


He got the Dragon Talon, I did not.

[Shadron]

doesn't really mean damage doesn't effect your drops. it just means his rolls happened to be better. Can't tell you how man times i have got top spot only to see people below me get better items. I think it has something to do with how the developers rank the epics. For whatever reason it seems that the atlantian helm is either the top ranked epic in the loot tables or nearly so, while chests, spears, and gauntlets are lower. as you do more damage your odds of getting that top ranked one seem to go up which would in turn impact your odds of getting the actual lower ranked epic you want.

[Sir Markus]

I think its completely random...

Have you noticed how many various posts about this are indicating you can't seem to get a read on how the loot drops are disbursed? Seems like there is no consistency to it at all.

I am subscribing to it being completely random---the only prerequisite being x amount of damage inflicted to get a loot drop at all.

But number crunchers feel free to investigate this further....if a pattern exists they will find it.

[ShadowClaw]

It is stated in the FAQs that the faster the monster is killed the better the loot is, how come you guys claim that its false?

[Sir Markus]

It is stated in the FAQs that the faster the monster is killed the better the loot is, how come you guys claim that its false?

I had not seen that. If that is the case then there you have it!

[Sir Markus]

Here is verbatim from the FAQ's:

"The more total damage you do to the monster, the better chance you will have to get better rewards. Keep in mind the faster you kill the monster, the better chance you will have to get better rewards. Damage done depends on your attack skill. Damage taken depends on your defense skill. "

All this is saying to me is that by causing more damage and killing it faster you have a better chance at getting better rewards. It does not guarantee any certain loot drop will occur at any given battle's conclusion.

But doing more damage/killing it faster maximizes your chances to get the good stuff!!

Now if only they would drop a $35 gas card....EPIC!!

[strife97]

While this might work as counter-point to the data once compiled, if required, it isn't COMPLETELY useful as I need to know what your ranking in the damage lists was as well, not just the damage which you dealt.

Sorry if I didn't make it clear before (it was late), but there were 8 of us fighting that Dragon, 8 only. So the Dmg + Loot posted is in descending order from 1st to 8th, with me at the top. I hadn't bothered to label them all accordingly cuz I thought I'd made it apparent that those were the only attackers on the Leaderboard (guess I didn't lol).

I edited in the ranking of the leaderboard now, it was 8 of us fighting the Dragon so that's everyone who was involved. If you want me to take a screenshot of the fight I'll do so next time I'm on, or you can take my word for it >_> I'll be posting up several more Loot drops off of different monsters that me and my friends are fighting (don't have the time right now to sort through them all) when im back online in either 7hrs or 12hrs (busy day *sigh*)

[Sophia Dragonhunter]

This is absurd. Enough already!

Defense does affect monster damage. This is true for all monsters. This has been tested over a very large sample size. Most current example for me personally is L4 Ambrosia compared to L4 Mephistopheles vs Keira (the most commonly used example for a Monster where defense doesn't matter). In a sample size of 50 power attacks each, Ambrosia did an average of ~73 points more per attack. That's well outside the margin of error. Defense still isn't as good as attack for this purpose, but it matters.
This only proves that defense from items and generals affects monster damage. It has always been like that, otherwise why would it choose the Holy Avenger instead of the Onslaught when attacking? Tell me there's a damage difference between 2 players with the same items & general, same attack score, but one has 1 defense and the other has 300, and then I'll believe you. Remember that the source for the +pDef is still a general (Ambrosia) in this case, so the point is moot.

Monster rewards are ONLY based on the damage you deal.
Sea Serpents' rewards are also based on how much you fortify.

There is a luck factor involved, but if you deal higher damage, you get better rewards. There is a significant point of diminishing returns; for instance you are barely getting anything better for doing 150k to an Emerald Serpent than 100k, generally a few more loot slots, but it's a lot less to get to the 1 epic tier than the 2 epic tier, and who really cares about the non-epics?
Agreed.

Killing faster = better loot has for some reason not been removed from the in-game text, but if there still is an effect from that it's been EXTREMELY trivialized in the game by the devs as a response to players many months ago. Some regular posters on these forums have even claimed to have confirmation from CA devs that faster is no longer better.
If the devs would've taken the time to answer a player, they would've updated the in-game FAQ... Since there's a random factor involved in the loot drops, it's hard to test it, but I'd go with the FAQ as long as it's there.

The real myth to dispel is that your placement on the damage listing matters at all. It doesn't. Just the total amount of damage.
Agreed.

[xienwolf]

This is absurd. Enough already!

Defense does affect monster damage. This is true for all monsters. This has been tested over a very large sample size. Most current example for me personally is L4 Ambrosia compared to L4 Mephistopheles vs Keira (the most commonly used example for a Monster where defense doesn't matter). In a sample size of 50 power attacks each, Ambrosia did an average of ~73 points more per attack. That's well outside the margin of error. Defense still isn't as good as attack for this purpose, but it matters.

Monster rewards are ONLY based on the damage you deal. There is a luck factor involved, but if you deal higher damage, you get better rewards. There is a significant point of diminishing returns; for instance you are barely getting anything better for doing 150k to an Emerald Serpent than 100k, generally a few more loot slots, but it's a lot less to get to the 1 epic tier than the 2 epic tier, and who really cares about the non-epics?

Killing faster = better loot has for some reason not been removed from the in-game text, but if there still is an effect from that it's been EXTREMELY trivialized in the game by the devs as a response to players many months ago. Some regular posters on these forums have even claimed to have confirmation from CA devs that faster is no longer better.

Your "rank" on the damage board does NOT IN ANY WAY affect loot; it's only there for reference purposes and as a way to sort the list on the monster battle. THE ONLY THING THAT MATTERS IS THE AMOUNT OF DAMAGE (+FORTIFICATION FOR SERPS).

The real myth to dispel is that your placement on the damage listing matters at all. It doesn't. Just the total amount of damage. In the immortal words of Bob Sagat, "F***ing stop it."

For your test with Ambrosia against Mephisto, I was not aware that those two generals had exactly the same attack value. In fact, I am pretty sure that they do not. A mere 73 points out of THOUSANDS is not statistically significant, and can easily be accounted for by a difference in attack strength. Unless you are claiming that Ambrosia was the one doing more damage, but even then, a mere 73 points from a potential +20 or whatnot from Ambrosia? That would mean that the contribution of defense (player stat) is quite negligible, as a single point of attack would make nearly that much difference.


And your claim that placement in the rankings is not important is the other side of the coin of the current test, which would be WHY WE ARE TESTING IT. To figure out which is true, amount of damage, or place in list. If the rank location didn't matter, one could beg the question of why they bother to have it sort by rank instead of by joining order. Would certainly be easier to code that way.

Anyway, you (and many others) claim that raw damage dealt is what matters, me (and many others) claim that ranking matters. So the ideal would be to find a battle where 10 people do roughly equal damage to the monster, and another battle where there are also 10 people, with the top damage player doing half of the monster's life, and the bottom damage player doing only a handful of power attacks, or even just a single stamina attack and nothing more. Such a comparison would make AMAZING data and answer the question very quickly (If in both cases the top damage and bottom damage had the same distribution of loot, it would mean my camp is right, if however the players on the equal damage list all got about the same distribution of loot as each other, while the top damage dealer on the other monster who halfway solo'd the beast got FAR MORE epic/rare slots, it would mean the other camp is correct)

Sorry if I didn't make it clear before (it was late), but there were 8 of us fighting that Dragon, 8 only. So the Dmg + Loot posted is in descending order from 1st to 8th, with me at the top. I hadn't bothered to label them all accordingly cuz I thought I'd made it apparent that those were the only attackers on the Leaderboard (guess I didn't lol).

I edited in the ranking of the leaderboard now, it was 8 of us fighting the Dragon so that's everyone who was involved. If you want me to take a screenshot of the fight I'll do so next time I'm on, or you can take my word for it >_> I'll be posting up several more Loot drops off of different monsters that me and my friends are fighting (don't have the time right now to sort through them all) when im back online in either 7hrs or 12hrs (busy day *sigh*)

Ah, I thought all of those results were YOUR results on various monsters, not every result everyone had on one beast. Nifty :)


EDIT: Now knowing that strife97's data is all rewards from within a battle, it is pretty clear that position does not directly equate to a precise amount of each loot category, as some people gained worse distributions than those below them (last player got an Epic item, 4th player did not get one. But most players did get at least the 1 epic and 2 lands). So there is a good case to argue toward damage dealt being the primary factor. Or at least the number of items from any category not being a guarantee even if based on ranking.

[Tridium]

Myths: More people attacking, more drop lot chances for all...

I suppose this might depend on your interpretation of the statement. Adding 10 people that do 1 damage each does nothing. However, adding 10 people that do a fair contribution definitely increases loot for all due to diminishing returns.

This is the trend I've noticed on monsters... Before Lotus's HP got nerfed I observed a threshold around 1 million damage. Below this point you only got a chance for one epic. Up to the threshold gradually increases that chance (I failed to get an epic at 800k once). Above the threshold you were guaranteed one epic and got chance for a 2nd one, presumably up to another higher threshold.

For an example, take some totally fictitious numbers... a monster with 10 million hp and a threshold at 500k. With 20 attackers doing 500k each, the total payout is ~20 epics. With 5 players doing 2M each, the total payout is ~10 epics. To optimize your payouts you want to do minimal damage to give good chances. If there are not enough attackers, other people need to "waste" stamina beyond an optimal point.

When looking at dragons, you can't just compare who got helm items. You first determine quantity of each tier based on damage. You then get a random chance to get an item from that tier. However, the distribution of those items is not necessarily equal (think of treasure chests chances). Premium items like helm pieces from dragons and Lotus's gauntlets probably have a lower chance.

[Sophia Dragonhunter]

Here's why faster kill might be equal to better loot:

Data on 5 different Emerald Sea Serpents' loot:

Emerald, 200k: 2 epic, 5 rare, 2 land
Emerald, 160k: 1 epic, 5 rare, 0 land :: slow kill
Emerald, 150k: 2 epic, 5 rare, 2 land
Emerald, 150k: 2 epic, 4 rare, 2 land
Emerald, 150k: 2 epic, 4 rare, 1 land

I joined that fight with 47 hours left on the clock and only got 1 epic, instead of the consistent 2 epic drops.

[xienwolf]

Aye, I need to search the forums some day for where people had decided that time didn't matter. Even though the FAQ claims it does matter, that document is VERY wrong in many places, so cannot be taken as all-knowing. Yet I do not recall how conclusive the decision had been when made. Wasn't much more than a month ago that it was discussed.

[ZeroWinZ]

Monster: Gold Dragon

Summoner: No

Time: N/A

Loot:
You have been rewarded 3 demi points of Corvintheus!
You have been rewarded 3 demi points of Ambrosia!
You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Ambrosia!
You have been rewarded 3 demi points of Aurora!
You have been awarded with: Death Knight! [attack: 9 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Mercenary! [attack: 5 defense: 3]
You have been awarded with: Orc Grunt! [attack: 7 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Lich! [attack: 7 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Vampire! [attack: 8 defense: 7]
You have been awarded with: Energy Bolt! [attack: 1 defense: 1]
You have been awarded with: Avenger Amulet! [attack: 5 defense: 2]
You have been awarded with: Avenger Amulet! [attack: 5 defense: 2]
You have been awarded with: Avenger Amulet! [attack: 5 defense: 2]
You have been awarded with: Avenger Amulet! [attack: 5 defense: 2]
You have been awarded with: Avenger Amulet! [attack: 5 defense: 2]
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Wolf Spirit! [attack: 7 defense: 5]

Damage Meter:
Lon ----------574,743 dmg
Nguyen ------568,317 dmg <- Me (Didn't get Wall of Fire)
Michael ------300,217 dmg
Venjur -------208,759 dmg
MaXX --------174,476 dmg
Allen --------160,969 dmg
Joseph -------158,659 dmg
Kendra -------101,529 dmg <- Got Wall of Fire
Flint Ironstag -3,450 dmg

Side Note: Also, I had also summoned a Gold Dragon once dealing at least 300k-400k, my friend Brian got Wall of Fire with only 140k dmg dealt.

[Sophia Dragonhunter]

The fact that it was a Wall of Fire doesn't matter, because you got a Wolf Spirit. Both are epic items.

[ZeroWinZ]

Yeah, I'm just annoyed.

[Shyft-]

For your test with Ambrosia against Mephisto, I was not aware that those two generals had exactly the same attack value. In fact, I am pretty sure that they do not. A mere 73 points out of THOUSANDS is not statistically significant, and can easily be accounted for by a difference in attack strength. Unless you are claiming that Ambrosia was the one doing more damage, but even then, a mere 73 points from a potential +20 or whatnot from Ambrosia? That would mean that the contribution of defense (player stat) is quite negligible, as a single point of attack would make nearly that much difference.

Have you ever fought Keira? I have trouble believing that anyone who's played a significant amount of time does not see that 73 points is definitely a statisically significant percentage difference. Ambrosia consistently does more. Do you know what the difference in stats is? In my test, it's a difference of -1 attack, +3 defense, and sixteen player defense. For a consistent ~3% gain of damage. Defense matters.

This only proves that defense from items and generals affects monster damage. It has always been like that, otherwise why would it choose the Holy Avenger instead of the Onslaught when attacking? Tell me there's a damage difference between 2 players with the same items & general, same attack score, but one has 1 defense and the other has 300, and then I'll believe you. Remember that the source for the +pDef is still a general (Ambrosia) in this case, so the point is moot.

This is an absurd red herring, and you know it. The difference is in player defense. It's embarrassing that you'd try and put this out there in an attempt to back up incorrect claims you've made in the past.

I think its completely random...

Have you noticed how many various posts about this are indicating you can't seem to get a read on how the loot drops are disbursed? Seems like there is no consistency to it at all.

I am subscribing to it being completely random---the only prerequisite being x amount of damage inflicted to get a loot drop at all.

But number crunchers feel free to investigate this further....if a pattern exists they will find it.

It's all about who you listen to. Some people do math and post findings based on it, others post on whimsy and assumption. I'm not going to tell you to listen to me, but take a look around and you'll find that my positions are presented more elegantly elsewhere as well. Find posts by Aquinas; that guy speaks to a higher level of accuracy than I'd even hold myself to and presents the data and explanations much more effectively than me. I doubt I'd ever have quarrel with his statements, which are backed by hard statistical evidence rather than the grossly fallacious conjecture put forth by many of the forum-goers here. http://castleageforums.com/cforum/showthread.php?t=6658 is a good example of this; originally posted with a lot of missing, incomplete, or outright wrong information, and completely on conjecture rather than actual data or even actual experience. But a bit of educated research on the forums helps you figure out whom to really trust. You make that decision for yourself, but the info is out there if you ignore the fluff.

[Aquinas]

Hi Shyft-

While I appreciate the support, I'm not sure on the defense thing...or if it is true, it would seem to me to be a minor contribution. Here is the data I have on dragons, hydras, and lotus.

http://i907.photobucket.com/albums/ac275/geneticoman/dragons-1.png

http://i907.photobucket.com/albums/ac275/geneticoman/hydra.png

http://i907.photobucket.com/albums/ac275/geneticoman/lotus.png

They all look quite linear to me.

Total damage = Damage per power hit
Total attack = Player attack + General attack + Gear attack

I did not include any defense stats here, the data is a mixture of LotF, Sophia's, and my data.

Edit: unless the developers changed the formula since this data was recorded.

[Sophia Dragonhunter]

This is an absurd red herring, and you know it. The difference is in player defense. It's embarrassing that you'd try and put this out there in an attempt to back up incorrect claims you've made in the past.

No it's not. Yes, it's player defense, but the source is still a general. Prove me that personal defense (coming from hard skill points spent into the stat) affects the damage dealt to dragons, and then I might believe you.

Edit: Oh and thanks for the plug. ;)

[jwagoner]

ok, well I can assist with this.

I have many generals and I have a high defense stat. My attack is 225. Someone with 225 contact me, we'll compare equipment, select a monster and run some tests.

[Mytch]

No it's not. Yes, it's player defense, but the source is still a general. Prove me that personal defense (coming from hard skill points spent into the stat) affects the damage dealt to dragons, and then I might believe you.

Edit: Oh and thanks for the plug. ;)

Sophia, if you can give me a few days I'll get you some numbers. On a business trip right now, so don't have much time, but I'm hoping to be back home tonight (8 AM here now >.<). My defense currently is just over 2.50x my attack, so should be able to see a difference in damage.

I already know which monster it affects more than others, but how much is still a curiosity. Anyway, my stamina is fairly low so it will take me a while to do a good test on a lot of creatures. If you are looking for info on specific ones, PM me - I probably won't see it if you respond here.

[Azraelswrd]

Yeah, even in my earlier experiment the difference due to defense was small but noticeable.

Sorry jwagoner, I'll be running my own tests tonight. The one potential flaw for me is whether levels are incorporated into damage output. I'm operating on the null hypothesis that it does not, but if it does this will throw my results into a tailspin. :eek:

[jwagoner]

Yeah, it level effects, that'll make it aweful >_<

[strife97]

Ah, I thought all of those results were YOUR results on various monsters, not every result everyone had on one beast. Nifty :)


EDIT: Now knowing that strife97's data is all rewards from within a battle, it is pretty clear that position does not directly equate to a precise amount of each loot category, as some people gained worse distributions than those below them (last player got an Epic item, 4th player did not get one. But most players did get at least the 1 epic and 2 lands). So there is a good case to argue toward damage dealt being the primary factor. Or at least the number of items from any category not being a guarantee even if based on ranking.

Oh one more thing to note, the player who dealt the least amount of damage was the summoner, might contribute towards uncovering whether the Summoner gets any special perks that aren't based solely on damage dealt (or ranking)

And I'll try and compile some info about whether the effects of Player Defense when attacking monsters (mostlikely on Dragons for now). I have some friends with VERY similar stats to my own (as they listen to me becuz of some past interactions, I was their leader lol), so will try and compare and see any anomalies between similar or identical Attack with a varying Defense and even different Level :D

[sarie]

She's deeeaadddd

Stats: Level 77, defence 110, attack 166
Monster: Sylvanas
Time: 30:15 remaining
General: Celesta

Loot:
0 Epic
1 Lands
1 Rare
3 Common
0 Points


You have been awarded with: Energy Potion! [attack: 0 defense: 0]
You have been awarded with: Dwarven Battlemaster! [attack: 9 defense: 7]
You have been awarded with: Valerian Guard! [attack: 7 defense: 9]
You have been awarded with: Flame Bow! [attack: 3 defense: 0]
You have been awarded with: Fireball! [attack: 5 defense: 0]
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
Leaderboard:
Jurai 441,015 dmg
Phil 403,377 dmg
Gary 184,345 dmg
Sarah 120,731 dmg <-- ME
David 64,999 dmg


Okay, there you go :] I just wanted to get my achievement really for this fight, sooo there is a lesser data set for you to use :]

[Aquinas]

If people are running tests on the damage output to total attack stats, I would suggest that you do not include any of the critical hits in the data since they are calculated differently (typically as a 1.5x, 2x, 3x, 4x depending on the monster).

[Azraelswrd]

Already taken care of Aquinas! (crits are just too extreme for stats) :D And strife reminded me to drop attacks that get "helped" for damage. With enough trials, those probably don't matter but I'll drop them anyways.

I can't wait to run 200 normal attacks per critter tonight... I can only imagine what my allies will be thinking when they see it. :p

[wyer]

Talking about myths, I heard that Lotus Ravenmoore puts out. Can any of you guys verify this rumor?

[jwagoner]

Well, if you don't mind getting flayed alive and turned undead, yeah, yeah she does

[Aquinas]

Already taken care of Aquinas! (crits are just too extreme for stats) :D And strife reminded me to drop attacks that get "helped" for damage. With enough trials, those probably don't matter but I'll drop them anyways.

I can't wait to run 200 normal attacks per critter tonight... I can only imagine what my allies will be thinking when they see it. :p

Actually, you will find that you won't need nearly so many attacks to determine the statistics. The random factor is merely a number with a fixed range that's added to the damage (for example, -50..50, -20...+20, again depending on monster type). Therefore, the variance of the data will in fact decrease the higher the damage values are. In fact you will probably be good with 5 power hits and 5 single attacks. Also, remember to have a full elite guard for Lotus :)

[Azraelswrd]

I just wanted to cover the bases and aimed for a higher sampling size. Originally I only used 10 power attacks but was criticized for not using more. I figure with 40-50 replicates, that should withstand some scrutiny.

[wyer]

Well, if you don't mind getting flayed alive and turned undead, yeah, yeah she does

I#ll pass that on to my sweetie in case he should get a roaving eye whilest out on quest!

[strife97]

Here's my Trial so far in contribution to the 4th Myth (is also in another smaller thread, but thought I'd post it here since as well since its relevant).

Well I got some initial trials done with the help of some close friends who play and are near my level and have similar stats (won't reveal their identities by giving out their real names). And from the looks of it...Defense doesn't play a role when fighting Dragons :eek: (in this case a Red Ancient), which baffles me becuz I swear with the new update Vanquish is doing "better" compared to before, even with her -20 Defense (she BARELY straggles behind Zaravok, before she wasn't even in the same range)

So here are the constant variables and such. ALL listed Players had a Full Elite Guard during the Trial. All Generals used are at lv 4. (One friend didn't give me a Trial using Vanquish, but his Zarevok Trial is interesting) So here is the data:


Friend #1, lv 126

219 Attack
20 Defense
260 Max Energy
100 Max Health
245 Max Stamina

Weapon : Holy Avenger [+12 damage]
Off-Hand : Atlantean Shield [+7 damage]
Helmet : Cowl of the Avenger [+12 damage]
Armor : Argentum Plate [+7 damage]
Amulet : Fear Charm [+9 damage]
Spell : Lightning Storm [+15 damage]
Glove : Steel Gauntlet [+1 damage]
Total Damage = +63

15 Normal Attacks with Zarevok lv 4
600
601
599
601
601
604
598
602
599
601
598
606
605
605
599
Avg: 601.267
Range: 598-606
Mode: 601

15 Normal Attacks with Vanquish lv 4
599
596
597
594
591
592
590
590
592
595
600
593
600
599
595
Avg: 594.867
Range: 590-600
Mode: 590, 592, 595, 600


Friend #2, lv 117

205 Attack
25 Defense
220 Max Energy
10 Max Health
229 Max Stamina


Weapon : Holy Avenger [+12 damage]
Off-Hand : Atlantean Shield [+7 damage]
Helmet : Cowl of the Avenger [+12 damage]
Armor : Argentum Plate [+7 damage]
Amulet : Amulet of Cefka [+6 damage]
Spell : Lightning Storm [+15 damage]
Glove : Steel Gauntlet [+1 damage]
Total Damage = +60

15 Normal Attacks with Zarevok lv 4
594
588
596
597
587
597
587
595
593
589
593
597
588
587
594
Avg: 592.133
Range: 587-597
Mode: 587 and 597

15 Normal Attacks with Vanquish lv 4
582
584
583
581
583
587
585
583
589
583
587
585
584
587
581
Avg: 584.267
Range: 581-589
Mode: 583


Friend #3, lv 104

200 Attack
40 Defense
220 Max Energy
100 Max Health
179 Max Stamina

Weapon : Holy Avenger [+12 damage]
Off-Hand : Dragon Scale [+4 damage]
Helmet : Cowl of the Avenger [+12 damage]
Armor : Atlantean Armor [+4 damage]
Amulet : Jewel of Fire [+7 damage]
Spell : Lightning Storm [+15 damage]
Glove : Death Touch Gauntlet [+12 damage]
Total Damage = +66


15 Normal Attacks with Zarevok lv 4
589
590
589
595
596
598
589
590
592
595
595
588
596
592
591
Avg: 592.333
Range: 588-596
Mode: 595

The most important thing to note (at least I think so), is that Friend #3 had better weapons than Friend #1, but Friend #1 did more Avg Dmg on the Dragon. Friend #3 had 19 less Attack than Friend #1, but had 20 more Defense than Friend #1, meaning that if Defense was included in Damage Calculation the same way as in PvP (.7*Def), Friend #3's Defense would translate to +14 Attack so Friend #3's Total Attack should be only 5 less than Friend #1, not to mention Friend #3's +66 Damage based off weapons as opposed to Friend 1#'s +63 Damage for his weapons. So unfortunately it isn't decisive, one would have to deduce just how important Friend #1 having 5 more Attack (using PvP style Defense calc) was over Friend #3 having +3 more Damage off of his weapons, in the resulting ~9 Damage difference (1.5% of Avg Dmg)

Another thing to take into account is Friend #2's results compared with Friend #3. Friend #3 had 5 less Attack than Friend #2, had 15 more Defense than Friend #2, and had +6 more Damage off of weapons than Friend #2, but their Zaravok results were nearly identical (Friend #3 didn't do more Damage than Friend #2 by even 0.05%). So it comes into question whether the equal Avg Dmg means that 5 more Attack is equivalent to 15 more Defense (possibly calculated as +10 Attack) and +6 more Damage off weapons, or if 5 more attack is simply more closely tied to +6 more Damage off of weapons...if someone can crunch numbers and figure that one out based on the data given, that'd be great :D

So now here's my own Trial not reflected against anyone but myself (becuz since I recently got a Dragon Helm my weapons are too much better than the Friends listed, at least by my standards)

Me, lv 135

223 Attack
3 Defense
260 Max Energy
106 Max Health
280 Max Stamina

Weapon : Holy Avenger [+12 damage]
Off-Hand : Tempest Shield [+4 damage]
Helmet : Helm of Dragon Power [+30 damage]
Armor : Dreadnought Plate [+8 damage]
Amulet : Poseidons Horn [+7 damage]
Spell : Lightning Storm [+15 damage]
Glove : Atleantean Gauntlet [+4 damage]
Total Damage = +80

20 Normal Attacks with Zarevok lv 4
622
620
630
626
628
622
622
625
625
630
624
630
626
620
628
629
626
621
626
625
Avg: 625.25
Range: 620-630
Mode: 626

(Added 6 stat points to Def, same level)
223 Attack
9 Defense
260 Max Energy
106 Max Health
280 Max Stamina

Weapon : Holy Avenger [+12 damage]
Off-Hand : Tempest Shield [+4 damage]
Helmet : Helm of Dragon Power [+30 damage]
Armor : Dreadnought Plate [+8 damage]
Amulet : Poseidons Horn [+7 damage]
Spell : Lightning Storm [+15 damage]
Glove : Atleantean Gauntlet [+4 damage]
Total Damage = +80

20 Normal Attacks with Zarevok lv 4
629
622
629
626
622
622
630
621
627
623
628
623
629
620
627
626
625
630
622
626
Avg: 625.35
Range: 621-630
Mode: 622

So for my Trial, the difference between the Avg Dmg is 0.1 >_> So one can either speculate that the added 6 Defense (converted to 4 Attack by PvP standards) was the "cause" of the increased 0.1 Avg Dmg, OR one can can assume that Defense DOESN'T play a role in Dragon Fights and thus the 0.1 difference in Avg Dmg was caused by regular discrepancies (which is VERY reasonable, becuz getting results within such a small range is far too difficult off of 15 attacks).

So you guys and gals can take this data and do what you want with it, I'm looking forward to hearing from others undergoing their own Trials tonight. Cuz as it stands (from my point of view), Defense isn't affecting Damage dealt on Dragons (in which case I don't know why Onslaught isn't used instead of Holy Avenger o_O) Funny, I kind of expect Zaravok to say something like "Zaravok > Vanquish" XD

[Kid Rock]

Here is my hypothesis that I am going to track using information from 2 different players.

Quantity of loot is based on the amount of damage inflicted.

Quality of loot is based on your level compared to the level of others in the battle, the % of your total Stamina you use, total health of the monster, % of attackers in your group based on the maximum group size. There is also a random factor involved based on the number of that particular monster you are fighting and the Premium piece most people are trying and hoping to get. Those would be items required to use in Alchemy, Favor Points, Land, and Demi Points.

Now, if someone out there can tell me exactly how to go about proving or disproving my hypothesis, please let me know.

Here is something for you all to think about. I had 33 Energy left the other day and spent it on an Emerald Serpent and fortified it. My 30 energy gave the ship about 54,000 in additional health. Of course it only took a few minutes to kill this easy one. I went and retrieved my Rewards and was probably the second or 3rd out of 10 people to get my stuff. I collected 4 DP, 4 Common, 4 Rare, 2 Land and 2 Epic. I thought this was an excellent return on investment.

This gives me reason to believe that the order you collect your Rewards in may play a part in how much and what you get. Also, using the last of your Energy in a sacrificial role may add bonuses. Mere speculation on my part.

Good luck to us all finding our answers.

Kenny~Kid Rock

[xienwolf]

Have you ever fought Keira? I have trouble believing that anyone who's played a significant amount of time does not see that 73 points is definitely a statisically significant percentage difference. Ambrosia consistently does more. Do you know what the difference in stats is? In my test, it's a difference of -1 attack, +3 defense, and sixteen player defense. For a consistent ~3% gain of damage. Defense matters.

I had missed the statement that this was against Kiera, as well as any statement that Ambrosia had been the higher hitting general. Hadn't double checked if that was included when I looked back to note my blindness as to which boss you had fought. Yes, against Kiera 73 is a decent, though still tiny, increase. Roughly what I would expect to see from a gain of 15 or so Attack, so supposing that there is a 70% defense application is valid in that test case.

Hi Shyft-

While I appreciate the support, I'm not sure on the defense thing...or if it is true, it would seem to me to be a minor contribution. Here is the data I have on dragons, hydras, and lotus.

http://i907.photobucket.com/albums/ac275/geneticoman/dragons-1.png

http://i907.photobucket.com/albums/ac275/geneticoman/hydra.png

http://i907.photobucket.com/albums/ac275/geneticoman/lotus.png

They all look quite linear to me.

Total damage = Damage per power hit
Total attack = Player attack + General attack + Gear attack

I did not include any defense stats here, the data is a mixture of LotF, Sophia's, and my data.

Edit: unless the developers changed the formula since this data was recorded.

Unfortunately these being linear doesn't mean much unless the player defense was also quite different. Though you mentioned that the data is from yourself and Sophia, so if you have invested in Defense at all (we all know she has not), then it gains a BIT more credence, not sure what LotF's defense is though. so potentially that is only 2 datapoints still, if you or LotF has ignored defense, so even if the function were a sine wave you would be able to slap a linear fit to it.

Yeah, even in my earlier experiment the difference due to defense was small but noticeable.

Sorry jwagoner, I'll be running my own tests tonight. The one potential flaw for me is whether levels are incorporated into damage output. I'm operating on the null hypothesis that it does not, but if it does this will throw my results into a tailspin. :eek:


The easy way to dodge the influence of a contribution to a level is to figure out what the random variance is during your first round of tests (the difference between lowest hit possible and highest non-crit possible), and then before you assign any of your stat points you run enough hits to verify that the min/max haven't moved yet (by attacking till you get the exact same min & max, or the exact same variance with a new min & max). After that is done to ensure that the level itself hasn't adjusted your damage output, you then assign the stats to defense and whack away again, till you achieve that variance once more. Typically it doesn't take too long to get the variance to show up once you are certain of what it is for the monster, then your sample sizes can be quite small (even just 2 hits if you luck out) and still accurate. Just do all calculations based on the minimum hit possible (or the mid or max if you really prefer, just so long as you are constant in the choice)

[strife97]

The easy way to dodge the influence of a contribution to a level is to figure out what the random variance is during your first round of tests (the difference between lowest hit possible and highest non-crit possible), and then before you assign any of your stat points you run enough hits to verify that the min/max haven't moved yet (by attacking till you get the exact same min & max, or the exact same variance with a new min & max). After that is done to ensure that the level itself hasn't adjusted your damage output, you then assign the stats to defense and whack away again, till you achieve that variance once more. Typically it doesn't take too long to get the variance to show up once you are certain of what it is for the monster, then your sample sizes can be quite small (even just 2 hits if you luck out) and still accurate. Just do all calculations based on the minimum hit possible (or the mid or max if you really prefer, just so long as you are constant in the choice)

Hehe, was going to be doing exactly what you're speaking of as I continue to level up. Will be placing points in Defense (probably won't go higher than up to 50, currently at 9), to notice of the Range of my Single Stam Attacks with Zaravok shift out of my 620-630 Range, hope to have more conclusive findings by this time tomorrow. If I level up tonight again, which I might, we'll at least have data of me at 3 Def, then me at 9 Def, then me at 14-15 Def, so we SHOULD see SOME sort of change, IF Defense plays a role when fighting Dragons.

[strife97]

Emerald Dragon (6 Friends on it out of total 10 ppl, I couldn't join cuz I got my Helm already but after looking at their drops I'm glad I didn't join in lol)

Rare Chance Drops:
[Dragon Charm]
[Fireball]
[Staff of the Tempest]
[Moonfall Crown]
[Gift Dragon]
[Gift Phoenix]

Epic Chance Drops:
[Rune Axe]
[Dragon Talon]
[Crystal Rod]
[Tempest Shield]
[Wolf Spirit]


3rd out of 10
49,119 dmg (my unlucky gf lol)

3 demi points of aurora
You have been awarded with: Helena's Memento! [attack: 1 defense: 0]
You have been awarded with: Helena's Memento! [attack: 1 defense: 0]
You have been awarded with: Fire Elemental! [attack: 8 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Fireball! [attack: 5 defense: 0]

4th out of 10
47,243 dmg

You have been rewarded 2 demi points of Corvintheus!
You have been awarded with: Helena's Memento! [attack: 1 defense: 0]
You have been awarded with: Griffin! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Staff of the Tempest! [attack: 4 defense: 2]

5th out of 10
47,088 dmg

You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Aurora!
You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Ambrosia!
You have been awarded with: War Bear! [attack: 5 defense: 4]
You have been awarded with: Willow Wisp! [attack: 4 defense: 4]
You have been awarded with: Moonfall Crown! [attack: 6 defense: 3]

6th out of 10
47,088 dmg

You have been rewarded 2 demi points of Malekus!
You have been awarded with: Fire Elemental! [attack: 8 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Gift Phoenix! [attack: 20 defense: 16]
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Rune Axe! [attack: 8 defense: 6]

7th out of 10
46,495 dmg

You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Ambrosia!
You have been awarded with: Magic Missile! [attack: 1 defense: 0]
You have been awarded with: Water Sprite! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Fire Elemental! [attack: 8 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Staff of the Tempest! [attack: 4 defense: 2]
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Mountain Keep!
You have been awarded with: Tempest Shield! [attack: 4 defense: 6]

10th out of 10
17,214 dmg (joined in late, should have been on sooner XD)

You have been awarded with: Griffin! [attack: 6 defense: 6]

Very strange Loot trends... will be posting up more stuff (mainly Dragons) as I get them, have some data backed up as it is, have 7 Friends giving me their Loot drops along with my own stuff, curse us monster hunters lol

[Sophia Dragonhunter]

So you guys and gals can take this data and do what you want with it, I'm looking forward to hearing from others undergoing their own Trials tonight. Cuz as it stands (from my point of view), Defense isn't affecting Damage dealt on Dragons (in which case I don't know why Onslaught isn't used instead of Holy Avenger o_O) Funny, I kind of expect Zaravok to say something like "Zaravok > Vanquish" XD

Thanks for your analysis, it confirms my theory. The Holy Avenger is used instead of the Onslaught because defense coming from items and generals is used at 70% when damaging monsters. If equipping Ambrosia boosts your damage by 73, then 6 skill points into defense would be supposed to at least increase your damage by more than 0.1, which is not the case.

Sorry you had to waste skill points into defense to test this.

[Aquinas]

Unfortunately these being linear doesn't mean much unless the player defense was also quite different. Though you mentioned that the data is from yourself and Sophia, so if you have invested in Defense at all (we all know she has not), then it gains a BIT more credence, not sure what LotF's defense is though. so potentially that is only 2 datapoints still, if you or LotF has ignored defense, so even if the function were a sine wave you would be able to slap a linear fit to it.


I don't know what LotF's defense was at the time, he only gave me his total attack value (taking into account generals and gear). However, my current player attack and defense stats are 647 and 285 respectively. At the time of registering the data I believe I had the same defense stats. Also, forgot to mention that one other datapoint for the Lotus belonged to another player (don't remember the name, but if you do a search for the Monster experience table thread it should show up, along with the stats).

[strife97]

Thanks for your analysis, it confirmed my theory. The Holy Avenger is used instead of the Onslaught because defense coming from items and generals is used at 70% when damaging monsters.

I know that point stands firm in PvP, what I meant was that I don't get why Holy Avenger is being used with an indication that it does "[+12 damage]" seeing as how that's only its Attack stat value, rather than an expected 12 + (12 * .7) which would be +20 damage (rounded down), and this is not the case, which is why I'd think that Onslaught would deal "[+15 damage]" . That's what I meant, becuz in PvP it doesn't change the format into terms of +X damage, it gives both Attack and Defense stats of the weapon becuz its combined stats are superior to others in said person's inventory. So unless you can prove to me that the +12 ISN'T based off Holy Avenger's Attack stat and is instead derived in some other way and that behind the scene's Holy Avenger's Defense stat is doing its contribution towards inflicting damage on the Dragon, then I'll remain with my own theory on that part for now =]

[Sophia Dragonhunter]

Attack: 1
Defense: 1

General: Morrigan [9/10]

Weapon : Blade of Vengeance [+17 damage]
Off-Hand : Sword of Redemption [+50 damage]
Helmet : Helm of Dragon Power [+30 damage]
Armor : Atlantean Armor [+4 damage]
Amulet : Jewel of Fire [+7 damage]
Spell : Lightning Storm [+15 damage]
Glove : Death Touch Gauntlet [+12 damage]
Total: 135

01. 440 :: 3 exp :: 0 DPs
02. 440 :: 2 exp :: 0 DPs
03. 445 :: 3 exp :: 2 DPs
04. 441 :: 1 exp :: 1 DPs
05. 443 :: 2 exp :: 0 DPs
06. 443 :: 3 exp :: 0 DPs
07. 445 :: 2 exp :: 1 DPs
08. 440 :: 3 exp :: 1 DPs
09. 445 :: 2 exp :: 0 DPs
10. 438 :: 2 exp :: 0 DPs
11. 439 :: 1 exp :: 0 DPs
12. 438 :: 1 exp :: 0 DPs
13. 437 :: 2 exp :: 0 DPs
14. 439 :: 3 exp :: 0 DPs
15. 441 :: 3 exp :: 0 DPs
16. 443 :: 1 exp :: 2 DPs
17. 441 :: 3 exp :: 0 DPs
18. 436 :: 3 exp :: 0 DPs
19. 442 :: 1 exp :: 2 DPs
20. 435 :: 3 exp :: 0 DPs

Minimum damage: 435
Maximum damage: 445
Average damage: 440.55
Mode: 440, 441, 443, 445
Demi points: 45%

[strife97]

Sophia, not sure I understand the purpose of your post, well in relation to what we had been talking about before...

Well back to data for Loot Drop stuff (gonna be getting lazier with color coding but should still make sense)

Friend, 6th out of 7
113,598 dmg on Gold Dragon

You have been rewarded 2 demi points of Azeron!
You have been rewarded 2 demi points of Malekus!
You have been awarded 2 Favor Points!
You have been awarded with: Shadow! [attack: 7 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Barbarian! [attack: 10 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Shadow! [attack: 7 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Lich! [attack: 7 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Skeleton Warrior! [attack: 4 defense: 4]
You have been awarded with: Dragonbane! [attack: 5 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Wolf Spirit! [attack: 7 defense: 5]


Me, Frost Dragon (so whack, was less than 2K from it going towards my achievement)
98,700 dmg, 4th out 11

You have been awarded with: Energy Potion! [attack: 0 defense: 0]
You have been rewarded 3 demi points of Ambrosia!
You have been awarded with: Energy Bolt! [attack: 1 defense: 1]
You have been awarded with: War Bear! [attack: 5 defense: 4]
You have been awarded with: Griffin! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: War Lion! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Moonfall Crown! [attack: 6 defense: 3]
You have been awarded with: Castle!
You have been awarded with: Castle!
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Berserker Amulet! [attack: 5 defense: 4

Friend, Ancient Red Sea Serpent
769,794 dmg, 7th out 18

You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Azeron!
You have been rewarded 2 demi points of Azeron!
You have been rewarded 4 demi points of Aurora!
You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Aurora!
You have been awarded with: Spartan Shield! [attack: 0 defense: 2]
You have been awarded with: Shadow! [attack: 7 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Battle Spear! [attack: 2 defense: 1]
You have been awarded with: Battle Spear! [attack: 2 defense: 1]
You have been awarded with: Battle Spear! [attack: 2 defense: 1]
You have been awarded with: Battle Spear! [attack: 2 defense: 1]
You have been awarded with: Holy Shield! [attack: 4 defense: 2]
You have been awarded with: Demonic Armor! [attack: 5 defense: 8]
You have been awarded with: Demonic Armor! [attack: 5 defense: 8]
You have been awarded with: Demonic Armor! [attack: 5 defense: 8]
You have been awarded with: Castle!
You have been awarded with: Sky Sanctuary!
You have been awarded with: Sun Blade! [attack: 10 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Atlantean Map Piece! [attack: defense: ]
You have received a bonus of 1 demi points from your equipped general. (Friend had Morrigan equipped, so can take 1 Demi point away I guess)

[Sophia Dragonhunter]

Sophia, not sure I understand the purpose of your post, well in relation to what we had been talking about before...

I was testing demi points % with Morrigan equipped, but figured I might as well post it here in case someone had similar attack stat and items, but higher def.

[Aquinas]

Here's my Trial so far in contribution to the 4th Myth (is also in another smaller thread, but thought I'd post it here since as well since its relevant).


Hey strife97, I took the liberty of combining your data with my own and here is the result:

http://i907.photobucket.com/albums/ac275/geneticoman/dragons2.png

In this case:
Total damage = damage per single hit
Total attack = Player attack + General attack + Gear attack

Since this is combined data from Sophia, Lotf, you, and me there is a wide range in the defense stats (1-285). Therefore the fact that I still get a very good linear fit would indicate to me that player defense is in fact not factored into the equation at least for dragons.

The regression coefficients are in fact very close to what I originally estimated as the attack formula:

{damage per single} = {Total Attack} + 300

[jdavis6]

There's a complete Emerald serpent drop in the Sea Serpent Questions thread. (Since you also posted there you may be aware of it, but wanted to remind you if it slipped your mind.)

[strife97]

5 More Red Dragons for Loot Drops with several different Rank Slots on some, I numbered them so as to avoid confusion and will color code in my usual manner, altho I'll be bolding FP just becuz we all keep getting so many of them off Dragons =] (sure hope xienwolf is making good use of all this lol)


Me, Red Ancient Dragon #1
103,770 dmg, 10th out of 14

You have been awarded 2 Favor Points!
You have been rewarded 4 demi points of Ambrosia!
You have been awarded with: Skeleton Warrior! [attack: 4 defense: 4]
You have been awarded with: Mercenary! [attack: 5 defense: 3]
You have been awarded with: Lich! [attack: 7 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Lich! [attack: 7 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Flame Bow! [attack: 3 defense: 0]
You have been awarded with: Berserker Platemail! [attack: 4 defense: 2]
You have been awarded with: Castle!
You have been awarded with: Jewel of Fire! [attack: 7 defense: 6]


Friend, Red Ancient Dragon #1 (same as above dragon)
101,393 dmg, 12th of 14

You have been rewarded 3 demi points of Corvintheus!
You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Aurora!
You have been awarded with: Vampire! [attack: 8 defense: 7]
You have been awarded with: Battle Spear! [attack: 2 defense: 1]
You have been awarded with: Black Knight! [attack: 5 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Barbarian! [attack: 10 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Skeleton Warrior! [attack: 4 defense: 4]
You have been awarded with: Holy Shield! [attack: 4 defense: 2]
You have been awarded with: Jewel of Fire! [attack: 7 defense: 6]


Friend, Red Ancient Dragon #2
272,544 dmg, 3rd out of 12

You have been rewarded 7 demi points of Ambrosia!
You have been rewarded 2 demi points of Ambrosia!
You have been awarded with: Shadow! [attack: 7 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Battle Spear! [attack: 2 defense: 1]
You have been awarded with: Skeleton Warrior! [attack: 4 defense: 4]
You have been awarded with: Shadow! [attack: 7 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Black Knight! [attack: 5 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Dragon Charm! [attack: 3 defense: 1]
You have been awarded with: Berserker Platemail! [attack: 4 defense: 2]
You have been awarded with: Berserker Platemail! [attack: 4 defense: 2]
You have been awarded with: Berserker Platemail! [attack: 4 defense: 2]
You have been awarded with: Castle!
You have been awarded with: Mountain Keep!
You have been awarded with: Castle!
You have been awarded with: Sun Blade! [attack: 10 defense: 5]


Friend, Red Ancient Dragon #3
111,556 dmg, 9th out of 15

You have been rewarded 6 demi points of Malekus!
You have been rewarded 2 demi points of Malekus!
You have been rewarded 6 demi points of Corvintheus!
You have been awarded 2 Favor Points!
You have been awarded with: Barbarian! [attack: 10 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Skeleton Warrior! [attack: 4 defense: 4]
You have been awarded with: Death Knight! [attack: 9 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Berserker Platemail! [attack: 4 defense: 2]
You have been awarded with: Holy Shield! [attack: 4 defense: 2]
You have been awarded with: Castle!
You have been awarded with: Sky Sanctuary!
You have been awarded with: Rune Axe! [attack: 8 defense: 6]


Me, Red Ancient Dragon #3 (same as above dragon)
105,249 dmg, 10th out of 15

You have been rewarded 7 demi points of Malekus!
You have been rewarded 2 demi points of Malekus!
You have been awarded with: Lich! [attack: 7 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Mercenary! [attack: 5 defense: 3]
You have been awarded with: Lich! [attack: 7 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Holy Shield! [attack: 4 defense: 2]
You have been awarded with: Dragon Charm! [attack: 3 defense: 1]
You have been awarded with: Mountain Keep!
You have been awarded with: Castle!


Friend, Red Ancient Dragon #4 (same as above dragon)
136,783 dmg, 8th out of 20

You have been rewarded 5 demi points of Ambrosia!
You have been rewarded 3 demi points of Aurora!
You have been rewarded 4 demi points of Azeron!
You have been awarded 1 Favor Points!
You have been awarded with: Black Knight! [attack: 5 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Orc Grunt! [attack: 7 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Orc Grunt! [attack: 7 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Vampire! [attack: 8 defense: 7]
You have been awarded with: Skeleton Warrior! [attack: 4 defense: 4]
You have been awarded with: Lightning Bolt! [attack: 8 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Berserker Platemail! [attack: 4 defense: 2]
You have been awarded with: Castle!
You have been awarded with: Castle!
You have been awarded with: Wolf Spirit! [attack: 7 defense: 5]


Friend, Red Ancient Dragon #4 (same as above dragon)
114,546 dmg, 10th out of 20

You have been awarded 1 Favor Points!
You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Ambrosia!
You have been rewarded 5 demi points of Ambrosia!
You have been rewarded 2 demi points of Corvintheus!
You have been awarded with: Lich! [attack: 7 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Battle Spear! [attack: 2 defense: 1]
You have been awarded with: Shadow! [attack: 7 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Holy Shield! [attack: 4 defense: 2]
You have been awarded with: Mountain Keep!
You have been awarded with: Sky Sanctuary!
You have been awarded with: Rune Axe! [attack: 8 defense: 6]


Friend, Red Ancient Dragon #4 (same as above dragon)
101,821 dmg, 12th out of 20

You have been rewarded 7 demi points of Aurora!
You have been awarded with: Vampire! [attack: 8 defense: 7]
You have been awarded with: Mercenary! [attack: 5 defense: 3]
You have been awarded with: Death Knight! [attack: 9 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Dragon Charm! [attack: 3 defense: 1]
You have been awarded with: Lightning Bolt! [attack: 8 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Mountain Keep!
You have been awarded with: Castle!


Me, Red Ancient Dragon #5
102,592 dmg, 10th out of 15

You have been rewarded 4 demi points of Malekus!
You have been awarded with: Lich! [attack: 7 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Shadow! [attack: 7 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Black Knight! [attack: 5 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Vampire! [attack: 8 defense: 7]
You have been awarded with: Dragon Charm! [attack: 3 defense: 1]
You have been awarded with: Lightning Bolt! [attack: 8 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Sky Sanctuary!
You have been awarded with: Castle!
You have been awarded with: Wolf Spirit! [attack: 7 defense: 5]


Friend, Red Ancient Dragon #5 (same as above dragon)
27,323 dmg, 14th out 15

You have been rewarded 7 demi points of Aurora!
You have been awarded with: Lich! [attack: 7 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Mercenary! [attack: 5 defense: 3]
You have been awarded with: Dragon Charm! [attack: 3 defense: 1]

So based off this info (and my other info, and the stuff coming in) I'd say that I can't yet determine the Damage Leader's role, but in Ranks below 5th place, I can plainly see that it does NOT play a role on the Loot you will get, amount of Damage dealt is the meal ticket. If you do 110K min damage on an Ancient Red Dragon, you're more than likely gonna get an Epic Loot, and if you only do 100K you'll usually get an Epic Loot but isn't as certain as 110K or more.

My reason for saying that at 5th and below the Damage Leader ranking doesn't play a role in Loot Drops (higher the Rank the better the Loot) lies in this portion that I'd posted before of my friends fighting an Emerald Dragon

5th out of 10
47,088 dmg
You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Aurora!
You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Ambrosia!
You have been awarded with: War Bear! [attack: 5 defense: 4]
You have been awarded with: Willow Wisp! [attack: 4 defense: 4]
You have been awarded with: Moonfall Crown! [attack: 6 defense: 3]

6th out of 10
47,088 dmg
You have been rewarded 2 demi points of Malekus!
You have been awarded with: Fire Elemental! [attack: 8 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Gift Phoenix! [attack: 20 defense: 16]
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Rune Axe! [attack: 8 defense: 6]

The friend of mine who got 5th out of 10 people on the Damage Leaders board did NOT receive Loot better than the friend of mine who got 6th out of 10 people, yet they both had the EXACT same Damage dealt. Which leads me to think that at least at this range of Rank and below, the Damage you deal gives you the "chance" to get different sorts of Loot with no guarantees unless you reach a certain treshold (like 100-110K, roughly), but whether you're placed above or below another person doesn't matter. Just my thoughts based on the info I've seen coming in =]

[xienwolf]

I agree that the results thus far show more correlation to damage than to rank. I am also starting to think that the category for each loot is not fixed, justtje raw number of loot slots in general. Though even at that you are having to concede a small random chance for extra slots (some of you same dragon fights have a lower ranked person with more loot than a higher ranked one)

[strife97]

I agree that the results thus far show more correlation to damage than to rank. I am also starting to think that the category for each loot is not fixed, justtje raw number of loot slots in general. Though even at that you are having to concede a small random chance for extra slots (some of you same dragon fights have a lower ranked person with more loot than a higher ranked one)

Yea, I think there is a certain degree of luck based off similar Damage dealt, sort of like rolling a dice (think its been mentioned that way by other before). So people who deal similar Damage have a chance at getting certain different items based on a sort of "rolling of dice" (actually more like true and false computer code lol).

[tecvoid]

have the dev's every answered questions like this? would save time.

dont answer me with a no, it wouldnt help, if they have answered a technical question i would be curious as to what it was about, you can pm me because i dont want to hijack

[galaxy99]

Reading through the thread, I have a thought like to share with you guys. Since, it is an online game, the developers like more people to play each battle and have even change to kill monsters. Thus, they may use the percentage of your dmg out of the monster's total HP to determine the chance of drops, especially epics. The trick may be that it is not how high your dmg percentage guarantees the drops, but how close your percentage to the perfect average (HP/people joined) has the better chance. Of course, it is still random on which epic drops. The world monster is an exception from my theory become of the divisions involved.

#1 thought

You solo a dragon 100%, you have pretty good chance. However, because it is solo, dev may deduct the chance due to that reason.
2 kill a dragon 50% shall be the sweet spot.
3.................. 33%
and go on.

#2 thought

Or there is a number in dev's mind what percentage is the idea for each kind of monster. (HP/idea people participated). It should not be the max number for dragon and sea monster, but should be the max number of Kirea and Lotus though.

Maybe that's why those dmg leaders and the bottom of the pack do not get the best chance, but those 2,3,4,5,6 ranked have more chance as usually they are closer to the perfect average data.

In summary, more even damage among all participants in a monster hunter, the better chance is given to everybody. Those selfish one (fast/super killers) or lazy ones trying to tag on will not be rewarded as others.

More test is needed on my theory though.

[xienwolf]

At the end of the day, the developers are people who write code. People who write code like to keep it simple. Making exceptions like a decrease in loot payout for having solo killed the beast would not be something a programmer would willingly do. If it was done, it would be (as you stated) to encourage community interaction. But if that was the case, then they would announce that fact because it isn't something which will be clear to the players without being told that it was so.

The purpose behind the tests is to figure out what is very likely to be a simple mathematical equation, intended to be robust enough to apply to all monsters currently existing and any which may be made in the future. Some variables may change from one monster to another, but it is unlikely that each one has a unique setup with many exceptions for specific cases. That just isn't how programmers like to think.

[galaxy99]

At the end of the day, the developers are people who write code. People who write code like to keep it simple. Making exceptions like a decrease in loot payout for having solo killed the beast would not be something a programmer would willingly do. If it was done, it would be (as you stated) to encourage community interaction. But if that was the case, then they would announce that fact because it isn't something which will be clear to the players without being told that it was so.

The purpose behind the tests is to figure out what is very likely to be a simple mathematical equation, intended to be robust enough to apply to all monsters currently existing and any which may be made in the future. Some variables may change from one monster to another, but it is unlikely that each one has a unique setup with many exceptions for specific cases. That just isn't how programmers like to think.
Agree, they probably just made some ranges and threw a dice or two there just like those damn chests. lol

[Sophia Dragonhunter]

have the dev's every answered questions like this? would save time.

dont answer me with a no, it wouldnt help, if they have answered a technical question i would be curious as to what it was about, you can pm me because i dont want to hijack

Myth #1: No

Myth #2: "Keep in mind the faster you kill the monster, the better chance you will have to get better rewards."

Myth #3: "Total damage done determines what kind of items you receive at the end of the battle." and "The more total damage you do to the monster, the better chance you will have to get better rewards."

Myth #4: "Damage done depends on your attack skill. Damage taken depends on your defense skill."

Source: In-game FAQ and Help created by the Developers.

[sarie]

EMERALD DRAGON

Stats: Level 80-81, defence 115, attack 180
Monster: Emerald Dragon
Time: didn't track
General: Many (was getting the low guys to level 4)

Loot:
Demi Points: 6
Favor Points: 1
Common: 5
Rare: 2
Land: 1
Epic: 1
You have been awarded 1 Favor Points!
You have been rewarded 3 demi points of Aurora!
You have been rewarded 3 demi points of Malekus!
You have been awarded with: Helena's Memento! [attack: 1 defense: 0]
You have been awarded with: Griffin! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Water Sprite! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: War Lion! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Fireball! [attack: 5 defense: 0]
You have been awarded with: Gift Dragon! [attack: 16 defense: 14]
You have been awarded with: Moonfall Crown! [attack: 6 defense: 3]
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Dragon Talon! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
Leaderboard
Nathaniel 222,475 dmg
Sarah 162,861 dmgp <-- me
Jessie 29,822 dmg
Laura 10,669 dmg



KEIRA

Stats: Level 80-81, defence 115, attack 180
Monster: Keira, the Dread Knight
Time: didn't track
General: Celesta

Loot:
Demi Points: 5
Favor Points: 1
Common: 3
Rare: 3
Land: 3
Epic: 1
You have been rewarded 2 demi points of Corvintheus!
You have been awarded 1 Favor Points!
You have been rewarded 2 demi points of Aurora!
You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Azeron!
You have been awarded with: Mercenary! [attack: 5 defense: 3]
You have been awarded with: Fire Elemental! [attack: 8 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Helena's Memento! [attack: 1 defense: 0]
You have been awarded with: Gift Phoenix! [attack: 20 defense: 16]
You have been awarded with: Dragon Charm! [attack: 3 defense: 1]
You have been awarded with: Gift Dragon! [attack: 16 defense: 14]
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Castle!
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Dreadnought Horns! [attack: 6 defense: 3]
Leaderboard
Job 146,403 dmg
Urik Andre 141,051 dmg
Christopher 115,095 dmg
Sarah 111,056 dmg
Suzanne 99,917 dmg
Richard 32,659 dmg
Chimera 2,952 dmg
Jeremy 1,103 dmg



HYDRA

Stats: Level 80-81, defence 115, attack 180
Monster: Cronus, the World Hydra
Time: didn't track, down to the wire though
General: Many (was getting the low guys to level 4)
Position on Leaderboard: 4th
Damage: 1,015,694

Loot:
Demi Points: 4
Common: 4
Rare: 3
Land: 2
Epic: 2

You have been rewarded 2 demi points of Azeron!
You have been rewarded 2 demi points of Azeron!
You have been awarded with: Death Knight! [attack: 9 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Dwarven Battlemaster! [attack: 9 defense: 7]
You have been awarded with: Griffin! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Valerian Guard! [attack: 7 defense: 9]
You have been awarded with: Hydra: Epimetheus! [attack: 18 defense: 24]
You have been awarded with: Hydra: Rhea! [attack: 24 defense: 18]
You have been awarded with: Dragon Charm! [attack: 3 defense: 1]
You have been awarded with: Hydra: Atlas! [attack: 23 defense: 28]
You have been awarded with: Castle!
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Hydra: Atlas! [attack: 23 defense: 28]

[Mytch]

EMERALD DRAGON

Stats: Level 80-81, defence 115, attack 180
Monster: Emerald Dragon
...


(offtopic)

Just checked your profile. You have the dragon talon before getting wall of fire or even dragon scale.
You have DTG before getting even a single raven cloak or onslaught.

I've never felt so inadequate in my life.
Excuse me while I go cry in a corner. :(

[Azraelswrd]

That's some awesome luck... dare I say EPIC? :D

(I'm going to keep using that stupid word until I get my EPIC loot... heh heh, buckle up)

[sarie]

(offtopic)

Just checked your profile. You have the dragon talon before getting wall of fire or even dragon scale.
You have DTG before getting even a single raven cloak or onslaught.

I've never felt so inadequate in my life.
Excuse me while I go cry in a corner. :(

bahahah, sorry >.<

I just tend to have AMAZING luck sometimes (Seriously, drive through town without hitting a single red light sometimes.) I got my Gauntlet off my first ever Lotus fight, was fourth on the leaderboard with about 820k damage. And that Talon came from my SECOND Emerald fight.... So really, try not to feel to defeated.

If you like, I will share my emerald dragon source with you?

[strife97]

bahahah, sorry >.<

I just tend to have AMAZING luck sometimes (Seriously, drive through town without hitting a single red light sometimes.) I got my Gauntlet off my first ever Lotus fight, was fourth on the leaderboard with about 820k damage. And that Talon came from my SECOND Emerald fight.... So really, try not to feel to defeated.

If you like, I will share my emerald dragon source with you?

I've stumbled upon an Emerald Dragon source today too :cool:

[Mytch]

bahahah, sorry >.<

I just tend to have AMAZING luck sometimes (Seriously, drive through town without hitting a single red light sometimes.) I got my Gauntlet off my first ever Lotus fight, was fourth on the leaderboard with about 820k damage. And that Talon came from my SECOND Emerald fight.... So really, try not to feel to defeated.

If you like, I will share my emerald dragon source with you?

oO
I would be quite thankful for that!
I don't get a chance to check too often, so I don't know how well I could take advantage of it, but I would be very happy to have the opportunity to.

[faronc]

I really thought that defence helped vs dragons, but I crunched my numbers and they fall right on Aquinas' line without taking any of my 320 def. into account.

On another note, try to fit this into your numbers. These are the drops I got from an ancient red dragon. I have them memorised because they seemed so odd.

204k damage
5th place on the leaderboard.
1 favor points
1 favor points
1 random demi points
4 random junk
1 rare

The favor points made it worthwhile anyways, but I cannot figure out what sort of equation gives out that few items for that much damage. I couldn't see anything else on here that looks even remotely similar. I am currently fighting another ancient red, I will do 200k on it as well and see what happens.

[Azraelswrd]

Yeah, my own tests confirmed that defense has no significant effect on damage to dragons. However, based on Defyeler's data, it takes a lot of defense to make a visible difference. But defense does have an effect on damage to Sylvanas and Lotus, based on my trials (more obvious in the former, less obvious in the latter).


If xienwolf reads this, he should update Myth #5. Not dragons. Yes on Sylvanas and Lotus.

[xienwolf]

It is conclusively so on Sylvanas and Lotus? Maybe Kiera and the other Bosses as well? It would explain why Zarevok is so much better against Kiera than Vanquish is (that fact alone has been the reason I haven't stated outright that defense has NO effect in battle, because I had done extensive tests to prove such against Dragons a while back, but the formula was changed almost every update, so I quit that little hobby, except for a brief atttempt on Hydras when they came out again. At the time Kiera was the only boss around and I hadn't fought her yet, so never did test the possibilities there)

[indeterminate]

Sapphire serpent dropped:

You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Malekus!
You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Malekus!
You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Aurora!
You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Ambrosia!
You have been awarded with: Griffin! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Willow Wisp! [attack: 4 defense: 4]
You have been awarded with: Griffin! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Spartan Shield! [attack: 0 defense: 2]
You have been awarded with: Griffin! [attack: 6 defense: 6
You have been awarded with: Griffin! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Poseidons Horn! [attack: 7 defense: 3]
You have been awarded with: Faerie Wings! [attack: 6 defense: 2]
You have been awarded with: Faerie Wings! [attack: 6 defense: 2]
You have been awarded with: Faerie Wings! [attack: 6 defense: 2]
You have been awarded with: Faerie Wings! [attack: 6 defense: 2]
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Castle!
You have been awarded with: Atlantean Map Piece! [attack: defense: ]
You have been awarded with: Atlantean Map Piece! [attack: defense: ]


1st 1,690,876 dmg / 698,180 def
2nd 441,163 dmg / 908,720 def
Me 459,242 dmg / 162,160 def
4th 278,976 dmg / 87,060 def
5th 146,403 dmg / 40,820 def

[smegg0]

I havent been playing that long but

the first time I ever helped with a Hydra, I dont remember how much damage I did, but it couldnt have been very much because I hadnt been playing long and didnt have much stamina, but I received a Sky Sanctuary which is the top piece of land its worth $25,000,000 and gives me $200,000 income.....
this made the game so much easier for me as I had no problem with money and have never had to buy any more land since.

now since then I have battled numerous other hydras and monsters and have done much more damage but never received another one

so I think the rewards are just random and not dependent upon how much damage you do or otherwise..and sometimes you just get lucky

[illusion1287]

Ok here goes...

Hydra battle

My Stats
Atk 125,
Def 18

General : Zarevok Lvl 4 (+20atk Monsters)

Levels 30-60 [30 max]
Ram 1,820,188 dmg
Scott 1,749,409 dmg
Marc Anthony 1,685,248 dmg
Ram Mohan 1,263,537 dmg
"xxx" 1,128,414 dmg <--ME


Drops:

You have been rewarded 2 demi points of Malekus!
You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Aurora!
You have been awarded with: Energy Potion! [attack: 0 defense: 0]
You have been rewarded 2 demi points of Malekus!
You have been awarded with: Dwarven Battlemaster! [attack: 9 defense: 7]
You have been awarded with: Fire Elemental! [attack: 8 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Valerian Guard! [attack: 7 defense: 9]
You have been awarded with: Hydra: Rhea! [attack: 24 defense: 18]<-Rare
You have been awarded with: Hydra: Tethys! [attack: 21 defense: 21]<--Rare
You have been awarded with: Hydra: Epimetheus! [attack: 18 defense: 24]<--Rare
You have been awarded with: Dragon Charm! [attack: 3 defense: 1])<--Rare
You have been awarded with: Mountain Keep!
You have been awarded with: Hydra: Atlas! [attack: 23 defense: 28] <--Epic


Sweet...just noticed that I had all the Hydras in my keep..created my first Hydra!!! COOL! :D

[Mytch]

Lotus and Sylv~ are absolutely affected by defense. As someone who has much more in defense than attack, it's a rather obvious difference (you should just ask people who actually specialize in defense, we can just tell you outright).

["Jukka"]

I've been trying to find information on the so called "400k wall" phenomenon, I've seen a couple of mentions that attacks against monsters give a max of 400k (or 600k) money until your income exceeds 25M/h. I've reached 25M/h a while ago but nothing happened, so what's the deal here?

[Mytch]

The max is the max. Once you hit it, you get nothing more than that. 400k (600k) is what you get. The only way to get more is through the random help that results in doubled gold.

[jdavis6]

From my preliminary research doing damage in ~10,000 damage intervals on gold dragons there appears to be different loot tables being used at different levels of damage (frequency of a particular item showing up changes.) # of loot slots has a strong correlation with damage (+/- 1 total drop at similiar damage regardless of leadrerboard position), but at certain damage levels the composition of items in the average drop changes. I imagine the devs mix these around from time to time as well.

I have not tested with less than 4 attackers. Most have had greater than 10 attackers.

Items that are available in both epic and rare slots always show up in purple, but I am now counting them as a rare drop if they show up before the land in the list and epic if they show up after the land. Since I've never noticed a blue or purple in the middle of the normal stuff, for now I'll assume that rare and epic items are never included in the normal drop portion of the loot tables.

[Da Wimsta]

ok, well I can assist with this.

I have many generals and I have a high defense stat. My attack is 225. Someone with 225 contact me, we'll compare equipment, select a monster and run some tests.


Howdy, you may have pumped up your stats some since you posted, but I could match you in just a few days I'm sure.


135
Max Energy -- Do more quests
194
Max Stamina -- Launch attacks! (cost 2)
215 (+6)
Attack -- Offensive might
3
Defense -- Defense power
107
Max Health -- Withstand attacks

The plus 6 is Lyra, but I have quite a few Generals to select from.

I'm totally game for comparing some test runs.

Also, for the sake of item comparison I have:
Weapon : Blade of Vengeance [+17 damage]
Off-Hand : Sword of Redemption [+50 damage]
Helmet : Cowl of the Avenger [+12 damage]
Armor : Pauldrons of Light [+5 damage]
Amulet : Amulet of Cefka [+6 damage]
Spell : Lightning Storm [+15 damage]
Glove : Gildamesh's Gauntlet [+2 damage]

I'm very curious about these calculations, I seem to have bad luck, can't get the deathtouch and so forth...

[HellSAint79]

i got no epic loot but have 2 FP.

Gold Dragon

battle only took 7 hours to slay gold dragon
damage done: 194,433 dmg

You have been awarded 1 Favor Points!
You have been awarded 1 Favor Points!
You have been awarded with: Barbarian! [attack: 10 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Barbarian! [attack: 10 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Elven Plate! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!

[Master Q]

One myth to be busted is that damage rank is relevant in order to loot. Damage amount appears to be, and of course the higher amount, the easiest you get high rank. But anyway, I can't be "screwed" by someone climbing up the chart, since his damage done doesn't affect yours. You'd be surprised on how many actually believe they must be "Top 10". :o

[HellSAint79]

me and my sister fought this gold dragon..
battle only took 7hours.. FAQ said faster to kill the monster the better the loot drop..
my sister reward list:
You have been rewarded 3 demi points of Corvintheus!
You have been awarded with: Energy Potion! [attack: 0 defense: 0]
You have been rewarded 3 demi points of Corvintheus!
You have been awarded with: Death Knight! [attack: 9 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Energy Bolt! [attack: 1 defense: 1]
You have been awarded with: Iron Axe! [attack: 3 defense: 0]
You have been awarded with: Lich! [attack: 7 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Mercenary! [attack: 5 defense: 3]
You have been awarded with: Holy Shield! [attack: 4 defense: 2]
You have been awarded with: Dragonbane! [attack: 5 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!

XXXX 268,221 dmg
me 194,433 dmg
my sister 188,928 dmg
XXXX 155,991 dmg
XXXX 142,821 dmg
XXXX 132,013 dmg
XXXX 125,786 dmg
XXXX 122,181 dmg
XXXX 109,688 dmg
XXXX 107,932 dmg
XXXX 104,565 dmg
XXXX 100,305 dmg
XXXX 100,117 dmg
XXXX 50,229 dmg
XXXX 44,101 dmg
XXXX 28,345 dmg
XXXX 3,480 dmg

[Master Q]

Lotus done with 1,238,753 dmg

You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Corvintheus!
You have been awarded with: Energy Potion! [attack: 0 defense: 0]
You have been rewarded 2 demi points of Aurora!
You have been awarded with: Death Knight! [attack: 9 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Valerian Guard! [attack: 7 defense: 9]
You have been awarded with: Dwarven Battlemaster! [attack: 9 defense: 7]
You have been awarded with: Lich! [attack: 7 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Valerian Guard! [attack: 7 defense: 9]
You have been awarded with: Holy Shield! [attack: 4 defense: 2]
You have been awarded with: Greater Fireball! [attack: 6 defense: 1]
You have been awarded with: Holy Shield! [attack: 4 defense: 2]
You have been awarded with: Rune Axe! [attack: 8 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Mountain Keep!
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!

sigh.

[HellSAint79]

from same gold dragon from earlier post
i talk to the rank 1 on damage he got common stuff

whats wrong with the loot? all top 3 got only common stuff while below that got better stuff??

6 favor point + epic loot wolf spirit
10th, 107,932 dmg
You have been awarded 2 Favor Points!
You have been rewarded 2 demi points of Aurora!
You have been awarded 2 Favor Points!
You have been awarded 2 Favor Points!
You have been awarded with: Death Knight! [attack: 9 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Mercenary! [attack: 5 defense: 3]
You have been awarded with: Iron Axe! [attack: 3 defense: 0]
You have been awarded with: Greater Fireball! [attack: 6 defense: 1]
You have been awarded with: Holy Shield! [attack: 4 defense: 2]
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Wolf Spirit! [attack: 7 defense: 5]

[Master Q]

Is it just me or demi points are valued a lot? Imho 2-3 demi shouldn't be compared to an epic, in fact, when you capped an allignement they're usueless... aren't they?:(

[LilKayla]

I believe as do others that Favor points will take your epic or rare loot slots. So while FP can be nice, when you are hunting for an epic they can be something you don't want to see.

[quill]

may be drops have something do with influence gained in quest, so the more of the undead realm quest you have compleat the high the chance of a dtg from lotus and so on,

[Master Q]

I believe as do others that Favor points will take your epic or rare loot slots. So while FP can be nice, when you are hunting for an epic they can be something you don't want to see.

I understand Favor since they can be stacked for chance of elite stuff, but demis seem to be valued as half-favor, and their use is far less (and moreover, they can be obtained in bigger amounts in a single day 10 combats with the desired allignement). I'm not discussing fp, but dp.

[12q34e]

in reply to defence mattering. I have alotus huntig group and one of my members has 100 and 400+ defence. I have 36def and 400atk. We do the same amount of damage to lotus.

[sorjaixp]

2.7m damage done to Lotus
my defense is only xx
my attack is xxx
These are my loots
You have been awarded 1 Favor Points!

You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Corvintheus!

You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Malekus!

You have been awarded with: Flame Bow! [attack: 3 defense: 0]

You have been awarded with: Gift Dragon! [attack: 16 defense: 14]

You have been awarded with: Valerian Guard! [attack: 7 defense: 9]

You have been awarded with: Death Knight! [attack: 9 defense: 6]

You have been awarded with: Lich! [attack: 7 defense: 5]

You have been awarded with: Valerian Guard! [attack: 7 defense: 9]

You have been awarded with: Demonic Sword! [attack: 8 defense: 5]

You have been awarded with: Demonic Armor! [attack: 5 defense: 8]

You have been awarded with: Dragonbane! [attack: 5 defense: 5]

You have been awarded with: Greater Fireball! [attack: 6 defense: 1]

You have been awarded with: Raven Cloak! [attack: 10 defense: 8]

You have been awarded with: Berserker Amulet! [attack: 5 defense: 4]

You have been awarded with: Onslaught! [attack: 15 defense: 1]

You have been awarded with: Castle!

You have been awarded with: Mountain Keep!

You have been awarded with: Mountain Keep!

You have been awarded with: Marketplace!

[Princess Venera]

I have not gotten any favor points from any monster battles.

I still am hoping to get this one epic from a dragon

[HellSAint79]

i've read somebody say that raven cloak drop at 1mil and above but i got this raven cloak at 474,868 dmg

You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Azeron!
You have been awarded with: Water Elemental! [attack: 14 defense: 15]
You have been awarded with: Death Knight! [attack: 9 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Dwarven Battlemaster! [attack: 9 defense: 7]
You have been awarded with: Holy Shield! [attack: 4 defense: 2]
You have been awarded with: Demonic Sword! [attack: 8 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Raven Cloak! [attack: 10 defense: 8]
You have been awarded with: Mountain Keep!

[Cthulu]

I believe as do others that Favor points will take your epic or rare loot slots. So while FP can be nice, when you are hunting for an epic they can be something you don't want to see.

Im almost certain they dont.
They seem to take demi point slots, like epic demis. Their position in the lists would suggest tis too.

[indeterminate]

Red dragon:

You have been rewarded 5 demi points of Aurora!
You have been awarded 2 Favor Points!
You have been awarded 1 Favor Points!
You have been rewarded 3 demi points of Aurora!
You have been rewarded 4 demi points of Aurora!
You have been awarded with: Flame Bow! [attack: 3 defense: 0]
You have been awarded with: Orc Grunt! [attack: 7 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Orc Grunt! [attack: 7 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Lich! [attack: 7 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Black Knight! [attack: 5 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Black Knight! [attack: 5 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Lightning Bolt! [attack: 8 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Dragon Charm! [attack: 3 defense: 1]
You have been awarded with: Lightning Bolt! [attack: 8 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Dragon Charm! [attack: 3 defense: 1]
You have been awarded with: Dragon Charm! [attack: 3 defense: 1]
You have been awarded with: Castle!
You have been awarded with: Sky Sanctuary!
You have been awarded with: Sun Blade! [attack: 10 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Rune Axe! [attack: 8 defense: 6]

dmg: 1,081,992 dmg
yes that was particularly overkill :P

[Barnie]

For Myth #5:

Blue bar is less than 5% when Serpent died.

Amethyst Sea Serpent
Level 104 (not mine). 805,445 dmg / 632,919 def

You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Aurora!
You have been rewarded 2 demi points of Azeron!
You have been awarded 1 Favor Points!
You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Corvintheus!
You have been rewarded 3 demi points of Ambrosia!
You have been awarded with: Spartan Spear! [attack: 2 defense: 0]
You have been awarded with: Spartan Helm! [attack: 1 defense: 1]
You have been awarded with: Atlantean Archer! [attack: 12 defense: 10]
You have been awarded with: Atlantean Archer! [attack: 12 defense: 10]
You have been awarded with: Spartan Shield! [attack: 0 defense: 2]
You have been awarded with: Vampire! [attack: 8 defense: 7]
You have been awarded with: Demonic Mask! [attack: 6 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Atlantean Mace! [attack: 6 defense: 3]
You have been awarded with: Demonic Mask! [attack: 6 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Demonic Mask! [attack: 6 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Holy Shield! [attack: 4 defense: 2]
You have been awarded with: Holy Shield! [attack: 4 defense: 2]
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Atlantean Spear! [attack: 7 defense: 7]
You have been awarded with: Atlantean Spear! [attack: 7 defense: 7]
You have been awarded with: Sun Blade! [attack: 10 defense: 5]

[indeterminate]

Sylvanas:
755 666 dmg

You have been rewarded 2 demi points of Ambrosia!

You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Aurora!

You have been rewarded 2 demi points of Malekus!

You have been awarded with: Energy Potion! [attack: 0 defense: 0]

You have been awarded with: Lich! [attack: 7 defense: 5]

You have been awarded with: Valerian Guard! [attack: 7 defense: 9]

You have been awarded with: Flame Bow! [attack: 3 defense: 0]

You have been awarded with: Flame Bow! [attack: 3 defense: 0]

You have been awarded with: Flame Bow! [attack: 3 defense: 0]

You have been awarded with: Star Crystals! [attack: defense: ]

You have been awarded with: Fireball! [attack: 5 defense: 0]

You have been awarded with: Faerie Wings! [attack: 6 defense: 2]

You have been awarded with: Faerie Wings! [attack: 6 defense: 2]

[indeterminate]

keira, 1st position with 373409 dmg. about 1 hour 24 minutes on the clock

You have been awarded 1 Favor Points!
You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Corvintheus!
You have been rewarded 2 demi points of Corvintheus!
You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Aurora!
You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Corvintheus!
You have been awarded with: Shadow! [attack: 7 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Helena's Memento! [attack: 1 defense: 0]
You have been awarded with: Helena's Memento! [attack: 1 defense: 0]
You have been awarded with: Willow Wisp! [attack: 4 defense: 4]
You have been awarded with: Willow Wisp! [attack: 4 defense: 4]
You have been awarded with: Death Knight! [attack: 9 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Dragon Charm! [attack: 3 defense: 1]
You have been awarded with: Gift Dragon! [attack: 16 defense: 14]
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Mountain Keep!
You have been awarded with: Dreadnought Greatsword! [attack: 7 defense: 4]
You have been awarded with: Dragon Talon! [attack: 6 defense: 6]

[InfernoCRO]

solo keira

Boris 1,011,698 dmg

You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Aurora!
You have been rewarded 2 demi points of Ambrosia!
You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Malekus!
You have been rewarded 2 demi points of Malekus!
You have been awarded with: Water Sprite! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Willow Wisp! [attack: 4 defense: 4]
You have been awarded with: Death Knight! [attack: 9 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Mercenary! [attack: 5 defense: 3]
You have been awarded with: Water Sprite! [attack: 6 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Gift Dragon! [attack: 16 defense: 14]
You have been awarded with: Gift Phoenix! [attack: 20 defense: 16]
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Mountain Keep!
You have been awarded with: Marketplace!
You have been awarded with: Dreadnought Horns! [attack: 6 defense: 3]
You have been awarded with: Dreadnought Horns! [attack: 6 defense: 3]

[indeterminate]

9573 orcs killed

You have been rewarded 3 demi points of Corvintheus!
You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Aurora!
You have been rewarded 2 demi points of Corvintheus!
You have been rewarded 1 demi points of Aurora!
You have been awarded with: Angelic Plate! [attack: 3 defense: 3]
You have been awarded with: Spartan Shield! [attack: 0 defense: 2]
You have been awarded with: Valerian Mystic! [attack: 11 defense: 11]
You have been awarded with: Spartan Warrior! [attack: 2 defense: 1]
You have been awarded with: Spartan Shield! [attack: 0 defense: 2]
You have been awarded with: Atlantean Mace! [attack: 6 defense: 3]
You have been awarded with: Oathkeeper! [attack: 7 defense: 4]
You have been awarded with: Judgement! [attack: 10 defense: 5]
You have been awarded with: Oathkeeper! [attack: 7 defense: 4]
You have been awarded with: Atlantean Shield! [attack: 7 defense: 7]
You have been awarded with: Arcanist! [attack: 23 defense: 20]
You have been awarded with: Holy Gauntlets! [attack: 4 defense: 6]
You have been awarded with: Pauldrons of Light! [attack: 5 defense: 11]
You have been awarded with: Paladin's Oath! [attack: 7 defense: 8]


i have no idea to be pissed or happy that i didnt see any FPs lol

[deadalus]

The most accurate way to determine how damage is effected by someone's defense stat is to create three accounts for testing purpose. Have one account put all stats into att, have one put all into defense and have one put stats equally into both att and def. Keep these accounts at the same level. When one levels up, make sure the other two level up.
Have the three accounts attack the same monsters, the same number of times and compare the damages from each attack, making note of whether an attack is a crit or assisted because those can skew the results.
Keeping them the same level would remove their level as a variable, since it is unknown if level affects damage. Make sure the three accounts all use the same weapons and generals(at the same level) to eliminate them as variables.
Having a completely defensive and competely offensive build should quickly show whether how those stats affect damage done. The third equal build is to provide a control.

[Paksenarrion]

Ok, I sometimes go to Snopes for these kinds of things but this is fairly new and likely won't be addressed by snopes for a while. But the tag says

"IMPORTANT WARNING FOR CASTLE AGERS!!! The newest reason to NOT click ******* links or MultiUrl links when RTF in Castle Age. While most of these shortened links are just trying to make things easier in the Chat Logs, a nefarious few are using these links to STEAL YOUR FAVOR POINTS! Please. Do NOT click on any of these ..."

I know any link especially a tiny url etc. can hide attack links and other unpleasant experiences but can it take you somewhere where someone can hack your FP?

[Jehann]

Ok, I sometimes go to Snopes for these kinds of things but this is fairly new and likely won't be addressed by snopes for a while. But the tag says

"IMPORTANT WARNING FOR CASTLE AGERS!!! The newest reason to NOT click ******* links or MultiUrl links when RTF in Castle Age. While most of these shortened links are just trying to make things easier in the Chat Logs, a nefarious few are using these links to STEAL YOUR FAVOR POINTS! Please. Do NOT click on any of these ..."

I know any link especially a tiny url etc. can hide attack links and other unpleasant experiences but can it take you somewhere where someone can hack your FP?

They can't steal the literally, but there have been cases of *******'s linking to the purchase page. Imagine buying a general you didn't want. Or worse yet, one of those useless gifts. :eek:

[Paksenarrion]

Imagine buying a general you didn't want. Or worse yet, one of those useless gifts. :eek:

While I wouldn't mind a general or two, I am doing ok without. I haven't been that lucky with the once or twice I tried I usually don't have enough FP's to worry about accidently spending them on something I didn't want.

Thanks for answering.

[GreyRider]

Current Investigation: Rewards from a battle are based on the numerical damage dealt
Data Contributions Requested: Please post what monster you killed, your position in the damage list, and cut/paste the rewards you gained. It is helpful if you can state what category each item was from, but is not required as that information is available elsewhere in the forums.





Better Loot when the Summoner gets the last blow
Status: Confirmed FALSE
Denied in an email from the Developers themselves


Better Loot when the kill is completely faster
Status: Confirmed FALSE
Community testing has determined this myth to be inaccurate


Rewards from a battle are based on the numerical damage dealt
Status: Testing in progress, information required
No patterns seem to emerge so far. It seems that the most likely explanation is that you gain a random number of total drops, and the maximum possible is based on how much damage you deal. From there, each slot is picked much like a Treasure Chest from all possible drops, with the results being sorted after the fact. Thus you could be the highest damage dealer, but get the least amount of loot (random assignment of total loot slots not going your way), or you could hit for a single stamina and get an Epic drop (random pick of your single loot item happening to come out VERY favorable)
Basically, the only clear trend right now is that more damage = better chance of getting whatever you want from the beast. But there is quite certainly a point at which further damage has diminishing returns due to the probability involved in having things turn out any better for you.


Defense Stat does not affect damage against Monsters
Status: Testing pending, information appreciated
Each Monster seems to have a different manner of calculating the damage you deal to them, placing the largest weight on a different aspect of your character. Thus far it appears that Sylvana and Lotus (possibly all bosses?) have fairly high weight on Defense for how much damage you deal to them, while for Dragons defense has no bearing on damage dealt at all.


Quality of Loot is linked to how full the "defense" bar is at the time of kill
Status: Testing pending, information appreciated
Placed on here by request and semi-frequent surfacing. Personally, I have VERY little belief that this is true in any way shape or form. But no testing has been done to directly confirm/deny, so it will sit on the list as untested until that time.




--------------------------------

Primarily posting this to try and clear up some of the far too frequent questions on the forums. Finally decided it was time to get the data to back up my suspicion on number 3.

Please inform me of any other common "myths" (or any misconceptions really) which have already been tested one way or another. The first 2 were all I could think of at the moment. If there is something else which requires testing, feel free to post that as well, it'll get added to the list for checking out next.



I would be interested in seeing the criteria & results of your speed tests... as i understand it, speed IS one of the factors for determining loot drop %s... but it is in relation to a number of other factors...

[Saifear]

I would be interested in seeing the criteria & results of your speed tests... as i understand it, speed IS one of the factors for determining loot drop %s... but it is in relation to a number of other factors...

yes - me too, please!!

I was referred here (after a loong search ^^) cause someone told me there is no effect on loot if Fast-Killing..
Guess you know what the Help/FAQ page is saying about this and so I am now very interested in your results.. after all they clash with the official FAQ, no?
I would just believe you, if I wouldn´t have made the subjective experience (not only once) that it makes a big difference in loot whether - just for example: a Lotus dies with 40 hours left or with 1 hour (39 counted kills.. btw. still no Gauntlets - doesn´t matter if fast or slow ^^)

[xienwolf]

If you look up the Facebook group "Midnight Sun," they run experiments on CA monsters to determine things like this. They started up after I had posted this and done some of my own tests, but since my own interest in the project has waned (and I have deleted all my old data each time CA patched, as it was no longer completely reliable then), they are probably the best source for gaining information on how CA works.


Basically, their findings are that the amount of damage you do on a monster is what is important, and nothing else. Not standing in the rankings, nor speed of the kill, nor who lands the killing blow. And that dragons remain the best source for Favor Points.